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1870s Birkenhead Grange Road #1083814
22nd Apr 2022 11:37pm
22nd Apr 2022 11:37pm
Joined: Apr 2022
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Little Eversden, Cambridge
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geofflawrence Offline OP
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I've just joined and struggling to get the hang of it.

I'm looking for 1870s to 1890s Birkenhead street and address info, and photos even, to link ancestral connections, my grandfather having been born illegitimately in !876 in Birkenhead. He was given the forenames Thomas Spiers William George Latimer Taylor and surname Lawrence. His mother was Maria, my great grandmother, that's all, just Maria, although later Maria Taylor, possibly Barnett, possibly even Lawrence or Latimer! Her birth may have been 1851.

The addresses I have so far are :

290 Borough Road, my grandfather's birth address in 1876, which I suspect is 1 Taylor's Villa. Thomas Taylor must have been an important man......later he moved to a massive mansion in Oak Bank behind Taylor's Villas.

Taylor's Villas Borough Road: a Taylor connection, Thomas Taylor, a grocer, and family 1881 census...I don't think Taylor's Villas were built at the 1871 census.

20 Grange Road 1876, which I suspect is Regent's Place, at the Haymarket end of Grange Road, a Spiers connection, as it is Ann Spiers shop (1874 Morris Directory) , and, also Ann Spiers was a registrar of servants, and we think Maria was such.

23 Grange Road, or 23 Regent's Place was on the birth certificate of the address of Maria in 1876............we suspect it was actually 20 Regents Place; there's no census record for a 23 Grange Road or an address for 23 Regent's Place....is that correct? This is the Spiers connection, especially as there is a Tom Laurance b 1877 in the 1891 census for Ann Spiers shop in 9 Bridge Street. I noticed derekdwc had posted photos of Regents Place in the 1870s in a 2011 post here. But I can't view them, site says I have no authority to view.

No info then until 1899 when grandfather Lawrence marries in Bethnal Green in London. We have a death certificate for Maria Lawrence in Islington London in 1895, recording her birth in 1851, but we can't be sure if it is our Maria.

We also have 9 Halkin Street in 1881 Census with a daughter Maria Lawrence b.1854, the family of Phillip Lawrence engine driver of a steam boat. We have earlier and later addresses for this family. My grandfather's job on his death certificate was that his (unknown) father Lawrence was a barge-builder and another as an engineer, so this looks a good connection.

We have a Latimer connection at 185 Conway Street 1871 census, and another in 1881 census at 16 Beckwith St and later 7 Eldon Place, who had a son William George Latimer....we have located the great niece of William George, who lives in California.

So, I'd be delighted at any steers you dear bloggers can share on any info on names and these addresses, old maps, exactly where they were on the old OS maps (the Birkenhead 1840s to 1870s map has tremendous detail but the Haymarket section is missing.

Sorry for all the detail!!!!

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Re: 1870s Birkenhead Grange Road [Re: geofflawrence] #1083817
23rd Apr 2022 4:37am
23rd Apr 2022 4:37am
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bert1 Offline

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Geoff,
290 Borough Rd wasn't Taylors Villas, 1+2 Taylors Villas were between 330 and 332 Borough Rd in the directories.


God help us,
Come yourself,
Don't send Jesus,
This is no place for children.


Bertieone.
Re: 1870s Birkenhead Grange Road [Re: geofflawrence] #1083818
23rd Apr 2022 5:30am
23rd Apr 2022 5:30am
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bert1 Offline

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Regent Place was the opposite end of Grange Rd from the Haymarket, now known as Grange Rd West, Regent Pl was a building row next to what was a church.

https://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/CHS/birkenhead/RegentPlaceGrangeRoadWestPresbyterian


God help us,
Come yourself,
Don't send Jesus,
This is no place for children.


Bertieone.
Re: 1870s Birkenhead Grange Road [Re: geofflawrence] #1083819
23rd Apr 2022 5:59am
23rd Apr 2022 5:59am
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bert1 Offline

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23 Grange Rd, 1881 census, it runs from Charing Cross to Westbourne Rd

If you have Ancestry, the link will work.
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imagevie...Source&usePUBJs=true&pId=1701893


God help us,
Come yourself,
Don't send Jesus,
This is no place for children.


Bertieone.
Re: 1870s Birkenhead Grange Road [Re: geofflawrence] #1083821
23rd Apr 2022 6:33am
23rd Apr 2022 6:33am
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bert1 Offline

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This map will show from Haymarket to Charing Cross was previously called Grange Lane.

https://maps.nls.uk/view/102340990


God help us,
Come yourself,
Don't send Jesus,
This is no place for children.


Bertieone.
Re: 1870s Birkenhead Grange Road [Re: geofflawrence] #1083822
23rd Apr 2022 7:25am
23rd Apr 2022 7:25am
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bert1 Offline

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This is the Halkin St Lawrence, Married John Sharp, Father, Phillip Hughes Lawrence. Engineer.

Name: Maria Jane Lawrence
Gender: Female
Marriage Age: Minor
Event Type: Marriage
Marriage Date: 7 Apr 1873
Marriage Place: Liverpool, St Peter, Lancashire, England


God help us,
Come yourself,
Don't send Jesus,
This is no place for children.


Bertieone.
Re: 1870s Birkenhead Grange Road [Re: bert1] #1083823
23rd Apr 2022 7:31am
23rd Apr 2022 7:31am
Joined: Apr 2022
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Little Eversden, Cambridge
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geofflawrence Offline OP
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Thnks for reply Bert1, much appreciated. I have seen all that info and use the NLS maps all the time, but without detail of local knowledge I get confused. The key 1871 census is a lot less clear about 20 and 23 Grange Road vs Regent's Place (Ann Spiers at 20 Regents Place is certain, but "our Maria" has reported it wrongly, in 1876, as 20 Grange Road) and even less about Borough Road, which I read was built between 1860 and 1871. The 1881 census is also unclear what number Borough road is for Taylor's Villa, Is it known when they were built?

So it is where was 290, maybe it was 390 Borough Road (on the birth certificate) in 1876. And what was the number for 1 Taylor's Villas then

derekdwc or a response to him in a 2011 blog here, reported that Regent's Place was 1 to 9 Grange Road, and yes mentioned that church I think, and even numbers only.

Re: 1870s Birkenhead Grange Road [Re: geofflawrence] #1083824
23rd Apr 2022 7:38am
23rd Apr 2022 7:38am
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bert1 Offline

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Geoff,
Have you seen Thomas's baptism, 23 Grange Rd?

Also go to forum search, enter, Taylors Villas

Last edited by bert1; 23rd Apr 2022 7:39am.

God help us,
Come yourself,
Don't send Jesus,
This is no place for children.


Bertieone.
Re: 1870s Birkenhead Grange Road [Re: geofflawrence] #1083825
23rd Apr 2022 7:49am
23rd Apr 2022 7:49am
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bert1 Offline

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God help us,
Come yourself,
Don't send Jesus,
This is no place for children.


Bertieone.
Re: 1870s Birkenhead Grange Road [Re: bert1] #1083826
23rd Apr 2022 8:02am
23rd Apr 2022 8:02am
Joined: Apr 2022
Posts: 6
Little Eversden, Cambridge
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geofflawrence Offline OP
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Hey, great info Bert1! Is it possible to view the attached pictures?

And yes, I have Thomas Spiers etc. Lawrence baptism cert from Holy Trinity. As you say, in that Maria says she is living at 23 Grange Road in 1876, but I couldn't find that address in the 1871 census... it in in the 1881 census as you say, but I can't see any connection with that family, who, of course, might be different from 1876.. I've assumed, because of the Spiers connection, Maria meant 20 Regents Place...maybe 23 Regents Place?

All clutching at straws really, so love your interest to help salve if not solve the between census confusion.

Re: 1870s Birkenhead Grange Road [Re: geofflawrence] #1083827
23rd Apr 2022 8:04am
23rd Apr 2022 8:04am
Joined: Apr 2022
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Little Eversden, Cambridge
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geofflawrence Offline OP
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I've got to help the wife....she has dementia......for an hour or two, but I'll rejoin the conversation later.....big thanks...

Re: 1870s Birkenhead Grange Road [Re: geofflawrence] #1083828
23rd Apr 2022 8:45am
23rd Apr 2022 8:45am
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bert1 Offline

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Originally Posted by geofflawrence
Hey, great info Bert1! Is it possible to view the attached pictures?


To view photographs is by subscription only, forum rules.


God help us,
Come yourself,
Don't send Jesus,
This is no place for children.


Bertieone.
Re: 1870s Birkenhead Grange Road [Re: geofflawrence] #1083829
23rd Apr 2022 8:52am
23rd Apr 2022 8:52am
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bert1 Offline

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Originally Posted by geofflawrence

So it is where was 290, maybe it was 390 Borough Road (on the birth certificate) in 1876. And what was the number for 1 Taylor's Villas then


As far as I know, Taylors Villas never had a Borough Rd number, they were always a stand alone address, 1+2 Taylors Villas, Borough Rd. Unlike a row called Taylors Terrace which had Borough Rd numbers.


God help us,
Come yourself,
Don't send Jesus,
This is no place for children.


Bertieone.
Re: 1870s Birkenhead Grange Road [Re: geofflawrence] #1083830
23rd Apr 2022 9:51am
23rd Apr 2022 9:51am
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Little Eversden, Cambridge
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geofflawrence Offline OP
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I've just been through the online post office directory for birkenhead 1878.

Joseph Taylor is listed in commercial and postal section as a Grocer at 316 and 318 Borough Road and I think he is related, brother, to the Thomas Taylor ship's carpenter of 1 Taylors Villas in the 1881 census; I could imagine this might be a connection of the building of Taylor's villas.

The Phillip Hughes Lawrence family of 9 Halkin St in the 1871 census is listed at 56 Eldon Street in the 1878 Post Office Directory. He is listed as a steam boat engineer. In 1861 he is listed at Wynnslay Street. Where was that?

Re: 1870s Birkenhead Grange Road [Re: geofflawrence] #1083831
23rd Apr 2022 10:33am
23rd Apr 2022 10:33am
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bert1 Offline

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According to page 1 of that census section it was in the Blackpool St, Waterloo Pl area.

Wynnstay Street.


God help us,
Come yourself,
Don't send Jesus,
This is no place for children.


Bertieone.
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