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Yes, I do realise that murder is unlawful and premeditated.

If McVey has been actively involved in making decisions that could reasonably be assumed to lead to someone's death, then someone died because of those decisions, that would be a premeditated action that caused death and would wholly justify the accusation.

An accusation does not imply certainty, the determination of certainty is a separate process.

Or do you believe you can only accuse someone that has already been convicted?

You're referring to manslaughter at best.

To be guilty of murder you have to set out to kill someone. Intentionally.

You're being deliberately obtuse and it's a shame as I sense you have the ability to come up with some decent and reasoned points but choose not to.

Manslaughter can't be premeditated, if its premeditated its murder.

If someone chooses an action which they know will probably kill people then what do you think should happen??? There is nothing obtuse about that, the deaths were clearly foreseeable and actually happened, an accusation is fully warranted and it should be up to the legal system to sort out if an offence occurred.

You're saying the same thing but using different words.

Conduct that was grossly negligent given the risk of death, and did kill, is manslaughter. Even then I think it's a pathetic argument by lefty lunatics.

Murder, for the avoidance of doubt (again), requires an action to be carried out an with intent to kill or cause grievous bodily harm. I'm sure they all sat around thinking of ways to kill people. Next you'll be comparing EM to Hitler!!!

Nobody set out thinking 'this will probably kill people'.

Personally i think this thread is getting out of hand. Graffiti was daubed, someone vented their anger at McVile, no need for getting google to win an argument by finding definitions. There's no need to call anyone lefties as if its an insult. So are righties any better for pulling out an imitation firearm? The way certain people are having ago at each others personal viewpoint the next thing you know it will be swinging handbags at dawn. Graffiti is wrong, in my opinion the way certain members of the current cabinet conduct themselves and their legislation are also wrong. Hopefully I will win my argument with them at the election.

There's nothing wrong with swinging to the left, per se.

It's the nutters who feel the need to spout crap such as 'murderer'.

I don't need google to know that there is no such thing as premeditated manslaughter, nor do I need google to know that deaths would be a consideration in the decisions about cuts and regulations of benefits.

The system very easily lets people drop out, if a person is not yet classified as high risk they will not have a follow-up to check if they have become high risk, the system doesn't allow for a trigger point happening that would put a person in the high risk group, they are left to their own devices. The trigger point could be lack of money for heating in cold weather or food or the psychological effects of being sanctioned or simply someone to proud to admit they need help.