WikiWirral Share a Little Learn a Lot about your Wirral
Forum Statistics
Posts1,023,265
Topics75,310
Members13,256
Forums65
Posts in last 24hrs22
Most Online14,906
Nov 23rd, 2019
Who's Online Now
44 registered members (alan128, 11 invisible), 4,980 guests, and225 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Social Media : Follow Us


Popular Topics(Views 7days)
New General Forums
Witch hunt?
by casper. 17th Feb 2020 7:20pm
Hi
by Oldskoolsam. 14th Feb 2020 4:19pm
Friends of Boris
by casper. 6th Feb 2020 9:16am
Australia
by lincle. 5th Feb 2020 8:12am
New Wirral History
41 Scotch Thistle
by Kylix. 7th Feb 2020 11:19pm
Christ Church Claughton School
by dingle. 7th Feb 2020 4:56am
Pictures of the 3 story houses in Brook Street
by GHAND. 24th Feb 2019 12:02am
1970's Murder in Central Park, Wallasey
by cutespam. 4th Aug 2018 11:28am
Any pics of Bentinck Street
by derekdwc. 17th Oct 2012 11:25am
Forum Tips
Photo Gallery Forums
Boaty McBoatface takes shape
The gathering storm: Mersey waterfront today
Topic Replies
Bultaco pursang
by Bultaco. 23rd Feb 2020 12:31pm
Writing Desk/Bureau
by Catsick. 23rd Feb 2020 8:27am
Branson's ship 'Scarlet Lady' docks this week
by Norton. 23rd Feb 2020 2:36am
dji spark drone
by _Steve_. 22nd Feb 2020 9:26pm
Bidston Hill Underground Tunnels Part 2
by Pete_Robbo. 22nd Feb 2020 7:51pm
Speedo Mick
by cools. 22nd Feb 2020 6:51pm
Lost Dog. Bichon Frise
by granny. 21st Feb 2020 11:29pm
What song are you listening to?
by Dilly. 21st Feb 2020 7:38pm
Plymyard Hall house
by diggingdeeper. 21st Feb 2020 4:07pm
February
M T W T F S S
1 2
3 4 5 6 7 8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16
17 18 19 20 21 22 23
24 25 26 27 28 29
Recent Posts : What's On ?
Branson's ship 'Scarlet Lady' docks this week
by Norton. 23rd Feb 2020 2:36am
HMS Prince of Wales visit to Liverpool
by Norton. 15th Feb 2020 4:06pm
Previous Topic
Next Topic
Print Topic
Rate Topic
Living with universal 'wages' #1069618
9th Jun 2019 6:33pm
9th Jun 2019 6:33pm
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 3,621
Wirral
V
venice Offline OP

Forum Guardian
venice  Offline OP

Forum Guardian
V
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 3,621
Wirral
Looks like if there was an election and Labour got in , John McDonnell is saying he would put Liverpool forward as a test area for a' universal basic income for everyone ' . I believe this failed in Finland , not sure about Canada , and Scotland are planning but yet to action it . Do you think it would work in Liverpool ,and would you like to see it in Wirral ?

Google Ads
Re: Living with universal 'wages' [Re: venice] #1069632
9th Jun 2019 7:44pm
9th Jun 2019 7:44pm
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,043
Birkenhead
diggingdeeper Offline

Wiki Master
diggingdeeper  Offline

Wiki Master
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,043
Birkenhead
It’s not just Labour, the Tories are looking at it as well.

The trial is doomed to failure because for some perverse reason it is going to be paying only half of what has been established as the minimum amount.

If anyone can give me some insight as to why they are trialing with half the amount I would amazed.

Last edited by diggingdeeper; 9th Jun 2019 7:46pm.

In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. George Orwell

We should judge our economy by the absence of poverty, not the number of billionaires - Jeremy Corbyn
Re: Living with universal 'wages' [Re: venice] #1069639
9th Jun 2019 8:50pm
9th Jun 2019 8:50pm
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 3,621
Wirral
V
venice Offline OP

Forum Guardian
venice  Offline OP

Forum Guardian
V
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 3,621
Wirral
I didn't know that . If it was a similar amount to universal credit, what would the difference be ? atm you have to apply for and accept suitable work offered in order to get your universal credit - would you not have to do the same to get your basic income I wonder?

Re: Living with universal 'wages' [Re: venice] #1069644
9th Jun 2019 9:22pm
9th Jun 2019 9:22pm
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 16,749
Wirral
granny Offline
Wiki Master
granny  Offline
Wiki Master
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 16,749
Wirral


Maybe we'll all be on benefits soon then. How on earth can it be half of the minimal amount ? They tried this in a similar way with the Job Evaluation scheme rolled out nationally. A particular job would be paid within a certain grading . Many lost their jobs with that, many others got masses amount of back pay. It also reduced the jobs . i.e. if two people did the same job between them at £10,000 each, but one person could do the job for £19,000 , that was the one who won the prize. So that job was then classified as a £19,000 job.

I maybe on the wrong track , but I can't see it working. Why are we always having to face change after change after change ? No wonder no one can get their lives established and finances in order.

Of course , we know what McDonnell' s hideous ideas are and what they would lead to .


Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
~Chief Seattle
Re: Living with universal 'wages' [Re: venice] #1069666
9th Jun 2019 10:22pm
9th Jun 2019 10:22pm
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,043
Birkenhead
diggingdeeper Offline

Wiki Master
diggingdeeper  Offline

Wiki Master
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,043
Birkenhead
Originally Posted by venice
atm you have to apply for and accept suitable work offered in order to get your universal credit - would you not have to do the same to get your basic income I wonder?


No, that's why it called universal, everybody except pensioners gets it unconditionally.

The majority of Governments want to introduce it as it makes a lot of sense even if it is counterintuative, however, there is a lot of opposition to it.

The small Finnish experiment didn't fail, nothing became worse, some things improved but employment levels didn't change.


In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. George Orwell

We should judge our economy by the absence of poverty, not the number of billionaires - Jeremy Corbyn
Re: Living with universal 'wages' [Re: venice] #1069667
10th Jun 2019 12:35am
10th Jun 2019 12:35am
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 16,190
New Brighton
_Ste_ Offline
Wiki Master
_Ste_  Offline
Wiki Master
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 16,190
New Brighton
They are all full of utter S**t!

Don't listen to a word they say. They are there to put you down not help you, i realised that 11 years ago and never looked back.

Tossers the lot of them.

Re: Living with universal 'wages' [Re: venice] #1069668
10th Jun 2019 12:45am
10th Jun 2019 12:45am
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 16,190
New Brighton
_Ste_ Offline
Wiki Master
_Ste_  Offline
Wiki Master
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 16,190
New Brighton
The rich get richer and the poor get poorer.

Don't be a sheep.


Re: Living with universal 'wages' [Re: venice] #1069677
10th Jun 2019 8:27am
10th Jun 2019 8:27am
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 16,749
Wirral
granny Offline
Wiki Master
granny  Offline
Wiki Master
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 16,749
Wirral


Interesting Ste. My grandfather always told his children, " There's no such word as 'can't'.. you can if you try " .


Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
~Chief Seattle
Re: Living with universal 'wages' [Re: venice] #1069678
10th Jun 2019 8:39am
10th Jun 2019 8:39am
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,693
wirral
E
Excoriator Offline
Forum Addict
Excoriator  Offline
Forum Addict
E
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,693
wirral
The real reason UBIs are being considered is to shore up the capitalist system.

When all workers are replaced by machines, and nobody gets paid, there will be no customers for what factories produce and the whole system will collapse. Solution: Print money and give it to the displaced workforce.This isn't as daft an idea as it sounds, given that the money spent will eventually come back as tax, and remember that although money cannot be created by you and me, it can and is created by governments at a sufficient rate to keep inflation at about 2%. This works out at increasing the amount of money by about 5 to 10% each and every year.

We are already at a stage where we can produce far more than is needed, which is why the huge advertising industry exists. (Around £23 billion in teh UK alone) It is there to persuade us we really need things that we don't like self-driving cars, pancake mix, and 'smart' egg boilers!

UBI seems to me inevitable, eventually, We will all be on 'benefits' which will be enough to live on. Those who have jobs too will be very few in number and be a lot richer.

Re: Living with universal 'wages' [Re: venice] #1069682
10th Jun 2019 11:48am
10th Jun 2019 11:48am
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,043
Birkenhead
diggingdeeper Offline

Wiki Master
diggingdeeper  Offline

Wiki Master
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,043
Birkenhead
That is the thing with UBI, it is attractive to both capitalists and socialists albeit for different reasons.


In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. George Orwell

We should judge our economy by the absence of poverty, not the number of billionaires - Jeremy Corbyn
Re: Living with universal 'wages' [Re: diggingdeeper] #1069700
10th Jun 2019 5:35pm
10th Jun 2019 5:35pm
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 3,621
Wirral
V
venice Offline OP

Forum Guardian
venice  Offline OP

Forum Guardian
V
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 3,621
Wirral
I read this and presumed withholding/cutting payment made the universal credit indirectly conditional ? ( the responsibilities I thought were actively looking and preparing for work etc and taking a job offer deemed suitable ?)

Q&A's
'Do you have to sign on with Universal Credit?'

'You may get a cut in your Universal Credit payment, known as a sanction, if you don't meet your responsibilities and can't give a good reason to explain why.'


Originally Posted by diggingdeeper
Originally Posted by venice
atm you have to apply for and accept suitable work offered in order to get your universal credit - would you not have to do the same to get your basic income I wonder?


No, that's why it called universal, everybody except pensioners gets it unconditionally.

The majority of Governments want to introduce it as it makes a lot of sense even if it is counterintuative, however, there is a lot of opposition to it.

The small Finnish experiment didn't fail, nothing became worse, some things improved but employment levels didn't change.

Re: Living with universal 'wages' [Re: venice] #1069744
10th Jun 2019 11:09pm
10th Jun 2019 11:09pm
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,043
Birkenhead
diggingdeeper Offline

Wiki Master
diggingdeeper  Offline

Wiki Master
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,043
Birkenhead
Ah, yes, my mistake, didn't realise that UC also incorrectly uses Universal.

Universal credit is conditional on signing on if you work less than 35 hours a week or if you do not jump through the many and obscure hoops that they "ask" (demand) of you.

Universal Basic Income (which also has numerous other names) is unconditional other than age.


In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. George Orwell

We should judge our economy by the absence of poverty, not the number of billionaires - Jeremy Corbyn

Moderated by  Mod 

Random Wirral Images

Click to View Topic.
Newest Topics
Branson's ship 'Scarlet Lady' docks this week
by Norton. 23rd Feb 2020 2:36am
Plymyard Hall house
by kasper. 21st Feb 2020 3:23pm
Lost Dog. Bichon Frise
by muzzy2. 19th Feb 2020 3:09pm
Data Controller Request
by Pete_M. 15th Feb 2020 5:27pm
Most Haunted, re Bidston Hill?
by Longnails. 15th Feb 2020 2:34pm
For Sale & Free
FREE - Denby Dinner Set
by Heidi123. 21st Feb 2020 3:15pm
Free Technics Hi fi system plus 2 speakers
by Heidi123. 17th Feb 2020 12:41pm
Writing Desk/Bureau
by Catsick. 16th Feb 2020 8:54am
2 Seater Leather brown Sofa
by dodie. 2nd Feb 2020 5:16pm
Old Amal long , Clutch, Brake, level ( Complete )
by Bultaco. 2nd Feb 2020 9:22am
Member Spotlight
granny
granny
Wirral
Posts: 16,749
Joined: June 2011
Show All Member Profiles 
Newest Members
Blue__bell21, Spencer, Sarah2020, Dutchie, Bentley
13256 Registered Users
Today's Birthdays
No Birthdays
New Wirral Info
Branson's ship 'Scarlet Lady' docks this week
by Norton. 23rd Feb 2020 2:36am
Plymyard Hall house
by kasper. 21st Feb 2020 3:23pm
Data Controller Request
by Pete_M. 15th Feb 2020 5:27pm
Most Haunted, re Bidston Hill?
by Longnails. 15th Feb 2020 2:34pm
Goldfish necessities
by ultimate. 10th Feb 2020 3:03pm
News : New Topics
Lost Dog. Bichon Frise
by muzzy2. 19th Feb 2020 3:09pm
HS2
by granny. 15th Feb 2020 9:03am
When Damascus Falls !
by granny. 13th Feb 2020 11:12pm
Storm Ciara
by cools. 7th Feb 2020 5:05pm
Philip Schofield
by cools. 7th Feb 2020 4:53pm
New Enthusiast Forums
Wirral Coast on TV - Tonight
by Norton. 7th Feb 2020 11:25am
Wirral Journal Free
by red_devil. 26th Jan 2020 10:15pm
Kodi
by GingerTom. 22nd Jan 2020 2:33pm
Bultaco pursang
by Bultaco. 13th Mar 2019 12:43pm
Bidston Hill Underground Tunnels Part 2
by robbo_theman. 23rd Sep 2008 8:58pm
Popular Topics(Views 24hrs)
Wirral Sunrise Sunset
Sunrise Sun 7:13am
Sunset Sun 5:37pm
Local Time Sun 1:23pm
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.1.1