WikiWirral its great, register, enjoy and welcome.
Forum Stats
12256 Members
65 Forums
72908 Topics
983021 Posts
200 posts in the last 24hrs
Max Online: 7831 @ 8th Apr 2013 4:18pm
Who's Online - Click Me
87 registered (alan128, 13 invisible), 1967 Guests and 337 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Social Media : Follow Us


(Views 7days)This Weeks Most Read
Boom : New Ferry Explosion 2649
Death at Leasowe Train Station 564
Huge Gas Explosion in New Ferry Sat 25/03/17 470
Planet Earth Tonight 300
Has Talktalk been hacked yet again? 268
Snowhite's Bird Rescue 229
Reclaimed floorboards needed. 222
Activate Trip Computer on Astra J 165
Article 50 146
Another Terrorist Attack ? -London Islington 117
New General Forums
hi
by norma67
26th Mar 2017 7:42pm
Clocks go Forward
by Mark
25th Mar 2017 3:01pm
Mannequin Challenge AKA MRI Scan
by fish5133
24th Mar 2017 11:20am
Surely the most honest add.....
by buddy
20th Mar 2017 5:43pm
New Wirral History
information on picture frame maker
by locomotive
43 minutes 44 seconds ago
William Bernard's building, Birkenhead
by yoller
20th Mar 2017 4:27pm
1882 Plan of the borough of Birkenhead and Wards
by Dave_Wood
19th Mar 2017 11:57am
New Brighton Coop
by Mike_White
9th Mar 2017 12:48pm
Tranmere High School for Girls 1882 Chesnut Grove
by sarah708
6th Mar 2017 8:23pm
Forum Tips
Photo Gallery Forums
Birkenhead Transport Museum 24th Feb 2017
fireworks on the Mersey last night
Topic Replies
'Rescue Me' Charity Walk
by RUDEBOX
39 minutes 59 seconds ago
information on picture frame maker
by locomotive
46 minutes 9 seconds ago
What song are you listening to?
by eggandchips
Today at 05:27 PM
4 Ink cartridge (C526) for Canon MG 5300 Printer
by goodoldphil
Today at 03:36 PM
Article 50
by diggingdeeper
Today at 03:15 PM
boxed 10 inch tablet for sale
by stumpyduck
Today at 02:37 PM
live webcam from africa, a must see
by rocks
Today at 02:36 PM
Astra Car Mats
by cartoonhead
Today at 08:04 AM
Activate Trip Computer on Astra J
by chris123
Yesterday at 08:53 PM
March
M Tu W Th F Sa Su
1 2 3 4 5
6 7 8 9 10 11 12
13 14 15 16 17 18 19
20 21 22 23 24 25 26
27 28 29 30 31
Recent Posts : What's On ?
'Rescue Me' Charity Walk
by RUDEBOX
40 minutes 5 seconds ago
Planet Earth Tonight
by Excoriator
26th Mar 2017 10:31am
Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#665718 - 11th Feb 2012 9:38am Animal Experimentation
granny Offline

Wiki Master

Registered: 29th Jun 2011
Posts: 14007
Loc: Wirral

' Is it morally acceptable to experiment on non human animals to develope products and medicines that benefit human beings?'
and
'Do non human animals have rights ? '
_________________________
...and those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music.FN

Top
Lifestyle : Advertising
Click me for more Information......


Looking for a Service / Tradesman? Look in our Local Business Directory. Click Me
#665719 - 11th Feb 2012 9:40am Re: Animal Experimentation [Re: granny]
mrhanky Offline
Forum Addict

Registered: 1st Dec 2010
Posts: 1236
Loc: my house
popcorn

Top
#665734 - 11th Feb 2012 10:49am Re: Animal Experimentation [Re: granny]
rocks Offline

Wiki Guide

Registered: 2nd Apr 2011
Posts: 6649
Loc: 3/4 of the way there....
_________________________

The meaning of life is to find your gift. The purpose of life is to give it away.

Top
#665737 - 11th Feb 2012 11:07am Re: Animal Experimentation [Re: granny]
little_pob Offline
Smartchild

Registered: 30th May 2008
Posts: 442
Loc: Upton
Originally Posted By: granny

' Is it morally acceptable to experiment on non human animals to develope products and medicines that benefit human beings?'

Thalidomide and, more recently, TBN1412 passed animal trials without any indication of problems.

Whilst in vitro testing would probably have picked up the issue with TBN1412, it would have missed the birth defects thalidomide causes. Until artificial blood becomes available for transfusions, mass scale in vitro testing using human blood and blood products isn't really possible. Blood banks have enough trouble trying to get blood without having to compete with drug companies that would pay for your blood.

Computer modelling is still in it's infancy. Though I do wonder how many compounds ruled out by animal trials will be revisited once it hits maturity.
Originally Posted By: granny
'Do non human animals have rights ? '
I wouldn't go so far as to say rights. But as concious beings we have a duty of care over any organism we force our will upon.

Top
#665742 - 11th Feb 2012 11:16am Re: Animal Experimentation [Re: granny]
rhoobarb2002 Online   shifty
Veteran

Registered: 13th Aug 2011
Posts: 679
Loc: Wirral
I think you need to be more specific.

I would think its safe to say that a lot of us wouldnt be here if it weren't for medicines, procedures and other advances that would have been tested on animals over the hundreds of years. Doesnt make it morally right, but it does make it easier to deal with.

If you mean products as in cosmetic testing, that type of thing where it is not actually advancing us, then no, IMO that is wrong.

Its the same argument for eating animals, is it wrong to eat animals? no, we are omnivores by nature. It is natural for one organism to feed on another. Is it wrong to use animals in such a way for food that is unnatural or inhumane, i.e. veal, caged hens, killing sharks just for their fins, etc? Then yes, that is wrong.

If a loved one has the option to die or choose a medicine that has been tested on animals, the choice would be medicine with no hesitation.
If my kids were starving and there was a cow stood next to us, you can bet it would be steak for dinner, but that does not mean I agree with certain aspects of how animals are treated or exploited for anything other than food or medicinal benefit.

Just my opinion though, im sure there will be plenty of people who disagree with me :S


Edited by rhoobarb2002 (11th Feb 2012 11:19am)

Top
#665763 - 11th Feb 2012 11:48am Re: Animal Experimentation [Re: granny]
BandyCoot Offline

Forum Veteran

Registered: 7th Dec 2008
Posts: 5350
Loc: Birkenhead
It's all part of the food chain I think. If you're unlucky enough to be born as an animal it's a bummer. That doesn't mean that they should be mis-treated though. If anyone objects to animals being used then they should either volunteer to replace the animals or stop using make up, medicine, health treatment, eating, wearing leather shoes, using caged birds as pets, going to the zoo etc. etc. etc. It's just life, get on with it or top yourself to save you worrying.
_________________________
Birkenhead........ God's own Room 101.

Top
#665928 - 11th Feb 2012 4:20pm Re: Animal Experimentation [Re: granny]
keving Offline
Smartchild

Registered: 18th Apr 2011
Posts: 628
Loc: wirral
If the shoe was on the other foot i'm sure animals would use us and other species to aid their wellbeing.
It's been seen many times in History :

The dinosaurs ate cave men to survive
Apes enslaved humans in the future after a nuclear war
Dolphins took over Springfield and persecuted the Simpsons family and friends.


On another note, can vegetarians eat jellyfish? Are jellyfish animals, as they don't have brains?


Edited by keving (11th Feb 2012 4:21pm)

Top
#665937 - 11th Feb 2012 4:31pm Re: Animal Experimentation [Re: granny]
jabber_Ish Offline
Forum Master

Registered: 7th Jan 2010
Posts: 2942
Loc: Black Rock
Originally Posted By: granny

' Is it morally acceptable to experiment on non human animals to develope products and medicines that benefit human beings?'
and
'Do non human animals have rights ? '



i think the operative word here is " benefit"


in my opinion testing should be allowed for medicines and beneficial uses, as for cosmetics/shampoos and the like then
not at all

test em on lifers if u ask me
_________________________
><((((*> <*))))><

Top
#665948 - 11th Feb 2012 5:07pm Re: Animal Experimentation [Re: granny]
rhoobarb2002 Online   shifty
Veteran

Registered: 13th Aug 2011
Posts: 679
Loc: Wirral
How come no-one fights for vegetable rights? They are living organisms too arent they?

Top
#665950 - 11th Feb 2012 5:14pm Re: Animal Experimentation [Re: rhoobarb2002]
keving Offline
Smartchild

Registered: 18th Apr 2011
Posts: 628
Loc: wirral
Originally Posted By: rhoobarb2002
How come no-one fights for vegetable rights? They are living organisms too arent they?


Because they haven't got brains like jellyfish, scarecrows and PCSO's

Top
#666385 - 13th Feb 2012 12:36pm Re: Animal Experimentation [Re: granny]
Wench Offline

H4H County Volunteer
Wiki Veteran

Registered: 9th Aug 2008
Posts: 8616
Loc: Second Circle of Hell.
Plenty of scrotes serving life in prison for very nasty crimes to test these things on - that way, we know what the reaction will be on a "human" smile
_________________________
Sometimes Police Officers give more than just speeding tickets!

Itís hard to be fit as a fiddle when youíre shaped like a cello!

Top
#666890 - 14th Feb 2012 11:32pm Re: Animal Experimentation [Re: granny]
MattLFC Offline
Wiki Master

Registered: 14th Aug 2004
Posts: 22315
Loc: Moreton/Beirut/Mobile
I tend not to think about it. No matter what I think or say, it's still going to happen. Gradually, I think the problem is improving, in light of efforts by campaign groups, and is certainly a lot better than 30 years ago.

But still, it shouldn't happen, but it does, tis just a fact of life, like many things. All those people who buy clothes stitched by 4 year olds getting paid nothing, and all those people who pay hundreds/thousands for their swanky iPhones etc, and then you hear the excessive rate of suicides and terrible working conditions for the people who make them. It will always happen, it's the way of the modern world unfortunately.

smile

Top
#667035 - 15th Feb 2012 11:26am Re: Animal Experimentation [Re: granny]
Nelzy84 Offline
Forum Guardian

Registered: 21st Dec 2010
Posts: 3354
Loc: Wirral
Not particualarly morally acceptable but in the grand scheme of things if it saving human life (medicinal research etc) then the means justify an end. Better tan testing on Refugees, minors or others Medical scandal


If it is for cosmetic purposes, then thats just bang out of order


Edited by Nelzy84 (15th Feb 2012 11:27am)
_________________________


Top

Moderator:  Mod 
Random Wirral Images

Click to View Topic.
Newest Topics
'Rescue Me' Charity Walk
by RUDEBOX
37 minutes 34 seconds ago
information on picture frame maker
by locomotive
43 minutes 44 seconds ago
Activate Trip Computer on Astra J
by chris123
Yesterday at 06:06 PM
Will It Work For You
by granny
Yesterday at 08:26 AM
Death at Leasowe Train Station
by Mark
27th Mar 2017 10:02pm
For Sale & Free
4 Ink cartridge (C526) for Canon MG 5300 Printer
by goodoldphil
Today at 03:36 PM
Sky HD 2TB box
by chris123
Yesterday at 06:02 PM
Astra Car Mats
by chris123
Yesterday at 05:59 PM
195 65 R15 91H Car Tyre
by chris123
Yesterday at 05:57 PM
boxed 10 inch tablet for sale
by stumpyduck
26th Mar 2017 7:12pm
Featured Member
Registered: 21st Jan 2010
Posts: 837
Newest Members
nickyrob32, GeorgeHand, BoilerEngineer, flipmodefly, Noize
12256 Registered Users
Today's Birthdays
No Birthdays
New Wirral Info
'Rescue Me' Charity Walk
by RUDEBOX
37 minutes 34 seconds ago
Planet Earth Tonight
by granny
25th Mar 2017 11:50am
Reclaimed floorboards needed.
by Gold_Moon
25th Mar 2017 10:45am
Has Talktalk been hacked yet again?
by Habdab
24th Mar 2017 10:25am
What does this all mean?
by venice
22nd Mar 2017 12:20pm
News : New Topics
Article 50
by granny
Yesterday at 11:13 PM
Death at Leasowe Train Station
by Mark
27th Mar 2017 10:02pm
KEYS found
by rocks
26th Mar 2017 11:48pm
Another Terrorist Attack ? -London Islington
by fish5133
26th Mar 2017 3:03pm
Huge Gas Explosion in New Ferry Sat 25/03/17
by Dogwalker59
26th Mar 2017 10:36am
New Enthusiast Forums
Activate Trip Computer on Astra J
by chris123
Yesterday at 06:06 PM
Will It Work For You
by granny
Yesterday at 08:26 AM
Snowhite's Bird Rescue
by diggingdeeper
26th Mar 2017 2:44am
Offset number plates
by venice
23rd Mar 2017 1:24am
File too large
by Dilly
20th Mar 2017 10:41am
(Views 24hrs)Trending Newest Topics
Article 50 147
information on picture frame maker 15
'Rescue Me' Charity Walk 5
Wirral Sunrise Sunset
Sunrise Thu 6:48am
Sunset Thu 7:44pm
Local Time Thu 7:39pm
WikiWirral Can . . . .
Advertising Click me
To Advertise with
Wikiwirral Click Me