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#324052 - 29th May 2009 4:17am Should we have gay clergy??
ChrisNewcastle Offline
Smartchild

Registered: 10th Dec 2007
Posts: 457
Loc: Newcastle upon Tyne/Ex wirral
This has been a hot topic in most religions around the world,and I was just wondering what you guys thought?? me personally could not give a fig...live and let live, but preaching is teaching at the end of the day. I'm a 'puff' myself but can understand the upset to deep believers but in this day and age....come on!!
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#324064 - 29th May 2009 8:33am Re: Should we have gay clergy?? [Re: ChrisNewcastle]
bert1 Offline

Wiki Veteran

Registered: 27th Nov 2008
Posts: 7948
Loc: tranmere
The law of averages say we have many many gay clergy now and have done for ever. What your question should be, should the churches openly recognize them. I am not a religious person but have always thought religion should reflect life, why should someone who is not classed as mainstream be denied a religious calling. The church is modernising, it just takes time.
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God help us,
Come yourself,
Don't send Jesus,
This is no place for children.


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#324118 - 29th May 2009 7:03pm Re: Should we have gay clergy?? [Re: bert1]
hoseman Offline
Forum Master

Registered: 30th Sep 2007
Posts: 2346
Loc: Bromborough
Problem with this is Bert... Would you let your son be a member of this persons parish and be in direct contact??
Not homophobic, dont get me wrong, but you hear soooo much aboout clergy abusing their position and then the child abuse comes to light!
And then there is the religeous aspect about gays!!
Would you let a mass murderer be a clergy?? Even if they have repented their sins to god etc... Would you go into an empty room with them and feel safe?? Didnt think so!!
I am a Catholic, non practicing, and i had religeon rammed down my throat at an early age, bunch of hypocrits to me, may as well be POLITICIANS!!!!!!
And you dont want to get me started on THAT subject....!!! LOL
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#324177 - 30th May 2009 5:57am Re: Should we have gay clergy?? [Re: hoseman]
bert1 Offline

Wiki Veteran

Registered: 27th Nov 2008
Posts: 7948
Loc: tranmere
I can't and would not make a link between homosexuality and pedophilia, if a child is in danger of being abused whether it is within the church or not it would be down to the latter rather than the former. As i see it and in answering your question, if the church was open about gay clergy at least you would have a choice of where to send your children, as it stands now people don't know what sexual persuasion there clergy are because it has to be kept under wraps. In the grand scheme of things are we going to refuse to let our children be in the presence of gay school teachers, medical people, etc, etc.
_________________________
God help us,
Come yourself,
Don't send Jesus,
This is no place for children.


Bertieone.

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#324761 - 1st Jun 2009 7:28pm Re: Should we have gay clergy?? [Re: bert1]
Softy_Southerner Offline

Forum Guardian

Registered: 2nd May 2008
Posts: 4093
Loc: Back in Devon
Gay clergy cannot be openly recognised by the church as homosexuality is a sin in their eyes.

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#324771 - 1st Jun 2009 7:42pm Re: Should we have gay clergy?? [Re: Softy_Southerner]
derekdwc Offline


Forum Veteran

Registered: 13th Oct 2008
Posts: 5024
Loc: Birkenhead
my friend who is a reverend does not believe in women clergy either
He believes only in what is in the bible
He asked a woman priest/priestess? if she believed in the bible
and when she said yes he asked her how she could be a priest
He says it is in the bible that a woman can't be a priest
Are they called Priest/Priestess/Mother/Father

Why does a church (the house of God)have lightning conductors



Edited by derekdwc (1st Jun 2009 7:45pm)

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#324786 - 1st Jun 2009 8:29pm Re: Should we have gay clergy?? [Re: derekdwc]
MissGuided Offline

Awesome
Wiki Guardian

Registered: 18th Jul 2008
Posts: 9995
Loc: Back of the wardrobe
34-36 When the Pharisees heard how he had bested the Sadducees, they gathered their forces for an assault. One of their religion scholars spoke for them, posing a question they hoped would show him up: "Teacher, which command in God's Law is the most important?"

37-40 Jesus said, "'Love the Lord your God with all your passion and prayer and intelligence.' This is the most important, the first on any list. But there is a second to set alongside it: 'Love others as well as you love yourself.' These two commands are pegs; everything in God's Law and the Prophets hangs from them."

Matthew 22:34-40
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#324807 - 1st Jun 2009 8:58pm Re: Should we have gay clergy?? [Re: derekdwc]
Wench Offline

H4H County Volunteer
Wiki Veteran

Registered: 9th Aug 2008
Posts: 8616
Loc: Second Circle of Hell.
Originally Posted By: derekdwc
my friend who is a reverend does not believe in women clergy either
He believes only in what is in the bible


I take it if that is the case, that he believes in child brutality, degrading women and their reproductive functions, motherhood, marriage? Making rape victims marry the men that rape them!?!?!?
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#324811 - 1st Jun 2009 9:04pm Re: Should we have gay clergy?? [Re: Wench]
diggingdeeper Offline

Wiki Master

Registered: 9th Jul 2008
Posts: 10792
Loc: Birkenhead
Originally Posted By: Wench
I take it if that is the case, that he believes in child brutality, degrading women and their reproductive functions, motherhood, marriage? Making rape victims marry the men that rape them!?!?!?
Some females just don't understand what males have to go through.... imagine having to take a vow of celebacy and then having to become a homosexual or paedo in order to only half break your vow.

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#324944 - 1st Jun 2009 11:58pm Re: Should we have gay clergy?? [Re: bert1]
marilyn Offline

Old Hand

Registered: 8th Feb 2009
Posts: 321
Loc: liverpool city centre
Originally Posted By: bert1
I can't and would not make a link between homosexuality and pedophilia, if a child is in danger of being abused whether it is within the church or not it would be down to the latter rather than the former. As i see it and in answering your question, if the church was open about gay clergy at least you would have a choice of where to send your children, as it stands now people don't know what sexual persuasion there clergy are because it has to be kept under wraps. In the grand scheme of things are we going to refuse to let our children be in the presence of gay school teachers, medical people, etc, etc.
im with you bert spot on also lucifer i agree live and let live

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#324947 - 2nd Jun 2009 12:08am Re: Should we have gay clergy?? [Re: marilyn]
MattLFC Offline
Wiki Master

Registered: 14th Aug 2004
Posts: 22315
Loc: Moreton/Beirut/Mobile
The church only want's you to believe what is beneficial for them. You think women are regarded as second class citizens in the Christian religion? Think again, but this is what the church likes you to believe.

Anyone who is interested in the conspiracy of how the church moulded History to suit them, take a look at a video I uploaded, recorded off BBC last year:

The Lost Gospels - The Truth The Church Doesnt Want You To Know

Originally Posted By: BBC Synopsis
Anglican priest Peter Owen Jones explores the huge number of ancient Christian texts that didn't make it into the New Testament. Shocking and challenging, these were works in which Jesus didn't die, took revenge on his enemies and kissed Mary Magdalene on the mouth. Pete travels through Egypt and the former Roman Empire looking at the evidence of a Christian world very different to the one we know, and finds over seventy gospels, acts, letters and apocalypses all circulating in the early Church.

I myself am a "sometimes practising" Roman Catholic, though thinking of changing to CoE because the RC religion does not match my beliefs. In honesty though, I don't know if I will be a Christian in 10 years time, Catholocism especially seem's to be a very hypocrytical religion, as are the vast majority of followers and preachers, and the video above has just about killed any faith I one had in the religion.

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#324961 - 2nd Jun 2009 1:44am Re: Should we have gay clergy?? [Re: MattLFC]
Wench Offline

H4H County Volunteer
Wiki Veteran

Registered: 9th Aug 2008
Posts: 8616
Loc: Second Circle of Hell.
Matt - there are some very worrying verses, chapters, books, whatever you want to call them, in the bible that encourage the things that I mentioned above. It's not so much what the Church want you to believe as what those that follow the bible to the letter are "told" to do.

I know the bible was written by "man" but the fact that some of it is so very disturbing got me into a lot of trouble when I was a teenager as I questioned them. I won't go into great detail, but I was told in no uncertain terms that I was "spawn of satan" and not welcome.

Thankfully, for me, I was allowed to grow and find my own way by my parents. There was always encouragement on free thinking and when my Dad died, the Church could offer me no answers or comfort, but Wicca and Paganism did. I've never looked back.

I have some very close friends that are of other religions, and some "acquaintances" who I would class as "fundamentalist Christians" - they are the ones that worry me the most. I have to say that I have more "Christian" values in my little toe than some of them do in their whole bodies. I've had Church going, God fearing people spit at my feet, cross the road to avoid being near me, had bird feet hung outside my front door, told that I should be burnt at the stake and a whole mirriad of things all because I appeared on a tv programme about Witchcraft. It beggars belief no

I don't care what religion people are, treat me with respect and I will do the same to you, same with colour, sexuality etc etc. A good person is a good person, irrespective of anything.
_________________________
Sometimes Police Officers give more than just speeding tickets!

Itís hard to be fit as a fiddle when youíre shaped like a cello!

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#324964 - 2nd Jun 2009 1:57am Re: Should we have gay clergy?? [Re: Wench]
MattLFC Offline
Wiki Master

Registered: 14th Aug 2004
Posts: 22315
Loc: Moreton/Beirut/Mobile
If you watch that video, even just the first 5 minutes, you will see that the "bible" that we know today, is far from the truth, indeed it is compiled of gospels and texts written some 400 years after the death of Jesus Christ.

The texts that have been uncovered which date from the time of Jesus' actual life, tell a very different story from what is now preached in the bible, and have the potential to shake the entire world of Christianity on it's head. The presenter of the programme, is himself, a Christian (Anglican) priest, yet has come to question the whole theology and the integrity of the roots of Christianity in light of the evidence that he has uncovered.

As the programme goes on to reveal, it is questionable as to whether Christianity would even have survived in the modern world, had it not been for the church's "tampering" with it's very origins. It also reveals how the entire religion, is based upon supression and scaremongering, and an overall show of superiority by the Christian church over their followers.

And as for Christianity in the UK, we all know that it shares its roots with Celtic Paganism, thank's to St Patrick's saving of Christianity after the Roman Empire fell, and Britain became a Pagan society. Indeed, had it not been for St Patricks convergence of Christianity into the Irish Paganistic belief, Christianity in Britain would not have become the mass-religion it is today within Britain, so if the preachers and anti-pagan's would care to revisit their own British Christian History, they would soon find out they actually have a lot to be thankful for of the Pagan religion.

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