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#947179 - 16th May 2015 10:46pm Return of Blood Sports?
RUDEBOX Offline

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Registered: 29th Aug 2008
Posts: 19087
Loc: Bob Land
What are your views?

I mean you might think you wouldn't need a vet to know that a creature ripped apart alive would die in agony, but just in case you do. Their obsession with fox hunting is emblematic of a larger truth about Tories, I think...namely that it doesn't matter who suffers, their "right" to do exactly what the hell they like overrides the happiness, health and very lives of plebs...ahem, I mean foxes. Tally fooking ho.

Vets say hunted foxes die in agony


Harrowing evidence that foxes and hares killed by dogs suffer painful deaths has dealt a blow to pro-hunt supporters who claim that blood sports are not cruel.
Tomorrow the Home Secretary, Jack Straw, will announce that the Government is to table a Bill offering a range of options on the future of hunting. The pro-blood sports Countryside Alliance was hoping that the lack of evidence of cruelty would help its campaign.

But independent forensic evidence by university veterinary surgeons on foxes killed by hunts and hares caught by greyhounds during coursing show that it is extremely rare for hunted animals to be killed instantly.

Post-mortems commissioned by the Home Office inquiry into hunting - and seen by The Observer - show no evidence to support claims by hunt supporters that foxes are killed by a 'quick nip to the back of the neck' and finds that in many cases foxes are disembowelled first. Five of the 12 hares killed were pregnant, and all had their necks broken by humans after bites by greyhounds had failed to kill them.

Independent vet Professor David Morton, who heads the department of biomedical ethics at Birmingham University, has examined the post-mortems carried out by vets from Bristol and Cambridge universities. He said: 'The fact that none of the animals died instantly clearly shows that they would have suffered. But probably more important is the mental distress these animals would have suffered before they were killed or caught.'

Vets from Bristol University examined the corpses of four foxes killed by hunting. Two of the foxes were shot, having gone to ground. Although the first fox hunted in Cotswold Park near Cirencester was killed by a single bullet, the post-mortem examination found evidence of 'trauma before death'.

The second fox hunted on Salisbury Plain had to be shot twice. Having gone to ground a terrier with a radio collar was sent down, and after 25 minutes of digging the fox was found. The first shot went through the animal's shoulder and failed to kill it, so another shot was required.

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But the post-mortem of the fox found it had suffered from multiple bite wounds on the face and the top of the head, damage to the right eye, and bite wounds round the throat.

In both cases where the fox was killed above ground by hounds, evidence was found of 'profound trauma'. In neither case was there major damage around the head or neck, as pro-hunt supporters claimed. The post-mortems showed the foxes had been attacked around the rib cage with the heart, lungs and stomach bitten. Morton said: 'In one case, the fox probably died from suffocation which might have taken several seconds, and in the other, where the heart was severely damaged, it looks the fox would have been attacked while upside down or on its side.'

But the post-mortems of animals killed in hare-coursing paint an even more disturbing tale of animal cruelty. The 12 post-mortems by vets of Cambridge University show that it is probable that 11 of the hares were not killed by the greyhounds despite suffering severe injuries through bites. The vets concluded that their deaths were likely to have been caused by men breaking their necks after they had been caught.

The hares' agonising deaths were revealed in The Observer in March when hidden film was taken of the premier hare-coursing event, the Waterloo Cup, attended by members of the Burns inquiry team. In some cases, men made several attempts to break the hare's neck after greyhounds fought over it.

This latest evidence of animal cruelty comes as an investigation by the International Fund for Animal Welfare revealed how the Royal Beaufort Hunt - used by Prince Charles, his sons and Princess Anne - has been breaching the rules of hunting. Hidden cameras filmed how an employee of the hunt had been rearing fox cubs for hunting. Animal rights groups want legal action to be taken against the master of the hunt, who include Captain Ian Farquhar, a close friend of Prince Charles.

http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2000/jun/11/hunting.ruralaffairs?CMP=share_btn_fb



Edited by RUDEBOX (16th May 2015 10:49pm)
Edit Reason: Re-arranged
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#947183 - 16th May 2015 11:03pm Re: Return of Blood Sports? [Re: RUDEBOX]
moretonjeffo Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 9th Mar 2011
Posts: 154
Loc: moreton
dont think its a tory problem its a c**t problem cant understand how anyone could think killing animals is ok

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#947185 - 16th May 2015 11:14pm Re: Return of Blood Sports? [Re: RUDEBOX]
RUDEBOX Offline

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Registered: 29th Aug 2008
Posts: 19087
Loc: Bob Land
It's a 'Tory problem' because it is the Tory Gov't who are wanting to overturn the Hunting Ban.
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#947188 - 16th May 2015 11:17pm Re: Return of Blood Sports? [Re: RUDEBOX]
RUDEBOX Offline

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Registered: 29th Aug 2008
Posts: 19087
Loc: Bob Land
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#947197 - 17th May 2015 7:44am Re: Return of Blood Sports? [Re: RUDEBOX]
Heswall1958 Offline
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Registered: 30th Mar 2013
Posts: 177
Loc: Heswall
Petition signed. Only sicko's could get off on seeing innocent animals killed.

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#947208 - 17th May 2015 8:34am Re: Return of Blood Sports? [Re: RUDEBOX]
Dilly Offline
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Registered: 17th Jul 2011
Posts: 7679
Loc: wallasey
signed. evil Bast#rds.

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#947209 - 17th May 2015 8:48am Re: Return of Blood Sports? [Re: RUDEBOX]
Greenwood Offline
Smartchild

Registered: 20th May 2011
Posts: 601
Loc: Greasby
Signed. Fox hunting should have gone the way of bear-baiting, cock-fighting etc, long, long ago. Just because it's 'traditional' doesn't make it right.

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#947227 - 17th May 2015 10:39am Re: Return of Blood Sports? [Re: RUDEBOX]
venice Offline

Forum Master

Registered: 21st Jul 2011
Posts: 2616
Loc: Wirral
That article was 2000 .All that pain was pre Tory rule . Foxes and Hoi-poloi dont feel pain these days. devil

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#947284 - 17th May 2015 3:52pm Re: Return of Blood Sports? [Re: RUDEBOX]
fish5133 Online   content
Forum Master

Registered: 22nd Mar 2010
Posts: 2859
Loc: Heswallish
Happy to sign .I am sure you would find more than Tories on the hunts--plenty of landowners around with big Labour signs on their land and UKIP. But I do like the analogy ...namely that it doesn't matter who suffers, their "right" to do exactly what the hell they like overrides the happiness, health and very lives of plebs...ahem, I mean foxes.

However its an analogy we may also need to look in the mirror and ask ourselves the same question.

I am not against hunting (for food or to some degree pleasure --as I fish ) but this method of hunting and the end result does seem barbaric and outdated and serving little purpose other than enjoying the kill. If guys want to dress up and ride horses across fields with a load of doggies then that's up to them but is it necessary to get pleasure from ripping an animal apart? If it is a valid form of pest control then ok but I doubt it is.

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#947291 - 17th May 2015 5:04pm Re: Return of Blood Sports? [Re: fish5133]
chriskay Offline
Forum Veteran

Registered: 25th Oct 2007
Posts: 4868
Loc: shropshire
Originally Posted By: fish5133
If it is a valid form of pest control then ok but I doubt it is.


I'm not in favour of hunting but there's no doubt about the increase in the fox population as a result of the ban. When I lived in the country I used to shoot foxes at the request of the local poultry farmers and I can tell you that I, as an ex-member of the Bomber Command rifle team, found it remarkably difficult to get within the necessary 100 yards to take a confident shot: they are almost as crafty as crows.
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#947319 - 17th May 2015 9:30pm Re: Return of Blood Sports? [Re: RUDEBOX]
granny Offline

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Registered: 29th Jun 2011
Posts: 13969
Loc: Wirral
Maybe a little knowledge is a dangerous thing and rather than city and town dwellers trying to make decisions for the farming community, they may also like to consider the plight of the Baby lambs that are torn apart and the hens that are killed by the foxes.

So control has to be used and fox hunting still goes on today in the rural areas, although not on horseback. Just a different type of sport, which the fox could end up maimed and injured and have a long slow painful death anyway, which is worse in many ways.

Must add, neither do I agree with the 'Tally Ho' brigade, but it is probably a quicker way to flush out the foxes.
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#947330 - 17th May 2015 11:57pm Re: Return of Blood Sports? [Re: granny]
venice Offline

Forum Master

Registered: 21st Jul 2011
Posts: 2616
Loc: Wirral
Granny ,the argument goes that foxes rarely take live lambs, they mostly take afterbirths and unviable lambs? Couldnt hill farmers bring down and keep mums and newborns in barns for a couple of weeks if they wanted to keep a eye on them whilst at most vulnerable-wouldnt that be good practice any way ?

As for feathered stock, Im a firm believer in making hen/duck houses/fencing that will withstand foxes . Decent guage sunken weldmesh at correct height properly posted etc , thick wood and foxproof catches on henhouses . Foxes are opportunists - make it hard and they move on to something easier.

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#947333 - 18th May 2015 12:36am Re: Return of Blood Sports? [Re: RUDEBOX]
diggingdeeper Offline

Wiki Guardian

Registered: 9th Jul 2008
Posts: 9867
Loc: Birkenhead
Fox traps are widely available and being quite lazy scavengers, foxes are quite gullible to them.

There is absolutely no need for barbaric bloodlust of hunts etc by humans - it is invariably just wild pack behaviour similar to the gang fights of the 1960s.

Foxes aren't rapid multipliers like rabbits or rats, simple humane controls of population size are very achievable provided the programs are correctly coordinated.
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When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. Socrates

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#947355 - 18th May 2015 9:35am Re: Return of Blood Sports? [Re: RUDEBOX]
casper Offline
Forum Addict

Registered: 13th May 2012
Posts: 1261
Loc: wallasey
Signed, still a bit worried that the Tories might substitute the unemployed for a substitute fox

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#947359 - 18th May 2015 10:09am Re: Return of Blood Sports? [Re: RUDEBOX]
Dilly Offline
Wiki Addict

Registered: 17th Jul 2011
Posts: 7679
Loc: wallasey
The Tally Ho gang are not interested in farmers plight with fox control,it is purely a sport for the blood thirsty. This should never be excepted in this day and age.

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