WikiWirral values you and your opinion.
Forum Statistics
Forums65
Topics76,347
Posts1,033,259
Members14,550
Most Online16,551
Feb 2nd, 2024
Who's Online Now
9 members (3 invisible), 10,094 guests, and 611 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Top Posters
sunnyside 45,164
MattLFC 22,315
Mark 21,269
granny 17,788
_Ste_ 16,345
Newest Members
JohnC, Luke2307, jharwood, TamTam, mrbigglesworth
14,550 Registered Users
New General Forums
Do we need Trident?
by derekdwc - 20th Jan 2016 1:11pm
New Wirral History
Tall Brick Chimneys
by diggingdeeper - 16th Mar 2024 11:56am
D.I.Y. / Building Shop
by mharford91 - 3rd Mar 2024 8:53pm
Looking for Joneses
by Markjon88 - 11th Apr 2019 7:06am
1970's Murder in Central Park, Wallasey
by cutespam - 4th Aug 2018 10:28am
Oleo Works
by Ducko - 14th May 2008 3:09pm
Top Posters(30 Days)
granny 15
casper 14
bri445 4
Topic Replies
This is Elvis
by GingerTom - 17th Mar 2024 2:37pm
Tall Brick Chimneys
by diggingdeeper - 16th Mar 2024 12:20pm
Gaza
by granny - 15th Mar 2024 10:13pm
Get your Money Tree ready
by StellaSimmons - 11th Mar 2024 11:50am
D.I.Y. / Building Shop
by bri445 - 4th Mar 2024 5:54pm
Xbox
by TudorBlue - 3rd Mar 2024 8:48pm
Restaurant/pub with outdoor seating - Bromborough
by Abakumss - 2nd Mar 2024 3:52pm
Oleo Works
by diggingdeeper - 1st Mar 2024 11:51pm
Wiper mechanism needed
by Gibbo - 28th Feb 2024 12:29pm
March
M T W T F S S
1 2 3
4 5 6 7 8 9 10
11 12 13 14 15 16 17
18 19 20 21 22 23 24
25 26 27 28 29 30 31
Top Likes Received (30 Days)
casper 1
Top Likes Received
bert1 14
Mark 4
granny 3
casper 3
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
#1072549 13th Nov 2019 12:03pm
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,788
Likes: 3
granny Offline OP
Wiki Master
OP Offline
Wiki Master
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,788
Likes: 3


Poulton of Poulton cum Seacombe, was named Poton . This map is Saxton's Map dated 1579.

Anyone know what the house could be at Poton ? Too early for the Manor houses, I believe.


http://www.bl.uk/onlinegallery/onli...X1PTtFpZ8F7MihgMKzwV7WtOqip4uBJbknwdfos0


Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
~Chief Seattle
Google Ads
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 85
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 85
that site link does not open for me it may have been moved or deleted. I have checked all references to this Poton and found nothing. But it could be that it is a map abbreviation as Poulton means 'small settlement by a small pool of water.' Another states: Poulton: Town or Farm by a pool. From pol tun

A 1637 Saxton map says Poulton. A 1611 map does not show Poulton or any variation. Above Seacum and what looks like Tulron or Pulron.

Last edited by red_devil; 13th Nov 2019 1:45pm.
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 85
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 85
I was trying to add more info above but it wont let me. I was trying to say that the 1637 map source is by the same originator that your link quotes but wont open.

Last edited by red_devil; 13th Nov 2019 1:49pm.
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 182
Enthusiast
Offline
Enthusiast
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 182
Map opens OK for me, can't shed any light tho', but notice the Poulton Lancelyn in Bromborough is named Pooton Lancelot

Last edited by daveybm; 13th Nov 2019 1:57pm.
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,788
Likes: 3
granny Offline OP
Wiki Master
OP Offline
Wiki Master
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,788
Likes: 3


Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
~Chief Seattle
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 14,334
Likes: 18
Wiki Master
Offline
Wiki Master
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 14,334
Likes: 18
I often think historians place too much reliance on spelling, in the past so much was passed on by word of mouth and scribes had their own styles and spelling methods.

Imagine someone from London trying to spell Saughall Massie when it was said by someone from Speke, its not going to happen is it!

Mistakes were made, mistakes were copied (much the same problems as we have with the internet these days).


We don't do charity in Germany, we pay taxes. Charity is a failure of governments' responsibilities - Henning Wehn

https://ddue.uk
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,788
Likes: 3
granny Offline OP
Wiki Master
OP Offline
Wiki Master
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,788
Likes: 3


As time moved on the names did change , we know that from the Viking connections, but also from the official archives where the landed Gentry mentioned and Royal Charters were recorded etc.

But I wasn't really bothered about the name apart from pointing out which Poton it was I was referring to.. my question was about the building on the map. If anyone knew what it was connected to.
I know they had ships that arrived there at the end of 1500's, and wondered if it might have been connected to a customs house or similar.


Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
~Chief Seattle
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 14,334
Likes: 18
Wiki Master
Offline
Wiki Master
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 14,334
Likes: 18
The houses on the map represent Manors which may or may not have Manor Houses but still having Manorial rights (whether executed or not).

In 1545 Poulton had a windmill, a pub, and a few small houses.

There is a lot of confusion between Poulton, Poulton-cum-Seacombe and Seacombe.


We don't do charity in Germany, we pay taxes. Charity is a failure of governments' responsibilities - Henning Wehn

https://ddue.uk
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,788
Likes: 3
granny Offline OP
Wiki Master
OP Offline
Wiki Master
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,788
Likes: 3

I found this site , which is interesting to browse through. This chart would indicate that it was a house rather than a manor. So it may have been Litherland's I was looking at but I'm not sure when they lived in Poulton. They were there around 1600's but I don't know how long before.

http://www.bsswebsite.me.uk/A%20Short%20History%20of/maps.html

I can't see the attachments but for anyone else the same one is on this link. House, church, manor house, cathedral.

Attached Images
1360jgoughbuildings.jpg (21.62 KB, 21 downloads)
Last edited by granny; 23rd Nov 2019 11:54pm.

Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
~Chief Seattle
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,788
Likes: 3
granny Offline OP
Wiki Master
OP Offline
Wiki Master
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,788
Likes: 3


Sorry DD, just realised what you were explaining. So it's denoting that some sort of hamlet/ community were living there ?


Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
~Chief Seattle
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 14,334
Likes: 18
Wiki Master
Offline
Wiki Master
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 14,334
Likes: 18
No, I think it denotes that there were manorial rights to this land, the Pooles. Houghs, Whitmores, Meoles, Gordons, Smiths etc had the rights at various times although most probably didn't live there (I think most of them had other Manors) and probably never imposed their rights. So it was probably a manor-less manor.

The churches on the map are where there are parish rights etc (mostly Woodchurch of course)

Its an ownership/rights map if you like not dissimilar to the hundreds maps.

From what I can tell, Poulton might have existed before Seacombe then both areas joined, then both areas separated again.

imho


We don't do charity in Germany, we pay taxes. Charity is a failure of governments' responsibilities - Henning Wehn

https://ddue.uk
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 447
Smartchild
Offline
Smartchild
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 447
Bird House

Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,788
Likes: 3
granny Offline OP
Wiki Master
OP Offline
Wiki Master
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,788
Likes: 3

That I think is a consideration too, Sonylegs. Reason. Birds house and barn was on the map in the mid 1600's and situated in the same place as it is now . Was known as Williamson's Croft .

Ships arrived in from Ireland .

Kathryn Brydd daughter of Wm Brydd married Robert Williamson 1580/81

Robert Williamson was Master of a ship named 'The Swallow' out of Wallasey

John Bird of Mayor of Liverpool owned ships

Richard Bird age 27 yrs sailed on the Pheonix one of John Bird's ships.

Also a ship called 'Speedwell of Wallazie'

The Birds of Chester were 'tanners'


The SPEEDWELL.] On trie 28th of March "the Speedwell of
Wallazie, Robert Ensdall* master, burthen 16 tons, from Dublin,
entered the Port of Liverpool. The cargo of the Speedwell
consisted of 17 packages of yarn, sent to several persons; of 150
yards of linen cloth; and of 1600 sheep, deer, and broke
[badger] fells' [skins.]


Page 38 https://www.hslc.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/122-3-Woodward.pdf

In addition it is quite clear that the animals were not unloaded at Chester,
but down the Wirral, and only a small number of the animals
seem to have entered the city. At Chester the sheriffs kept an
account of the duty paid by merchants, who were not freemen,
on goods shipped to the city for sale. These accounts have
survived in usable condition for eight years during the period
1605-24. 3<J Only for one year, 1611, is there a reference to
livestock; on 9 February Sam Bates of 'Hallifex' brought a
cargo of tallow, pig grease, bacon, beef and Tenn quicke
beeves' to the city while in July another merchant shipped
'ix quicke beastes'. There are, in fact, very few references in the
Chester city archives relating to the import of Irish livestock. In
the Assembly Book, for the period 1603-42, there are only two
references to Irish cattle. "

************
There's clearly been a fair bit of activity in Poulton in the late 1500's early 1600's and there's only one way that would have happened, due to seafaring . The way I see it, is that Poulton (Poton) was the quay for the off loading of live cargo, and the Old House, (Birds House) was possibly a place for the shipmates to stop off . The Barn would be for the animals.

There is another entry in Hslc : Rentals of Poulton @Seacombe During Eliz Ist reign ( 1558-1603) Richard Brydd a tenement with housing

Rental of Poulton @ Seacombe, 5 Eliz."
Had. MS. 2039, p. 89.
(h) " Pet Puford | Richard Brydd a ten' wh housyng thereunto
" Secam f and upon the back side of the house or
" yard croft adioyning to a tent of Mr. houghes.
" Item a barne and a Gardayn upon the backsyde thereof
" adioynyng to Tottyes grounde.

Last edited by granny; 11th Dec 2019 10:37am.

Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
~Chief Seattle

Moderated by  Mod 

Link Copied to Clipboard
Random Wirral Images

Click to View Topic.
Newest Topics
Tall Brick Chimneys
by diggingdeeper - 16th Mar 2024 11:56am
D.I.Y. / Building Shop
by mharford91 - 3rd Mar 2024 8:53pm
Xbox
by TudorBlue - 3rd Mar 2024 8:48pm
Possible Cause of Dementia
by diggingdeeper - 22nd Feb 2024 2:08am
Wiper mechanism needed
by Peter0787 - 20th Feb 2024 4:07pm
For Sale & Free
This is Elvis
by GingerTom - 17th Mar 2024 2:37pm
Member Spotlight
Gibbo
Gibbo
Formby
Posts: 2,282
Joined: December 2010
Today's Birthdays
There are no members with birthdays on this day.
New Wirral Info
Get your Money Tree ready
by keef666 - 22nd Mar 2023 12:27pm
Restaurant/pub with outdoor seating - Bromborough
by CarterUSM - 7th Aug 2020 7:59pm
Floral pavilion promo code?
by TheComputerLab - 31st Dec 2018 2:11pm
News : New Topics
Gaza
by diggingdeeper - 29th Oct 2023 9:28am
New Enthusiast Forums
Xbox
by TudorBlue - 3rd Mar 2024 8:48pm
Possible Cause of Dementia
by diggingdeeper - 22nd Feb 2024 2:08am
Wiper mechanism needed
by Peter0787 - 20th Feb 2024 4:07pm
Popular Topics(Views)
5,067,094 WIKI WALK CHAT
4,011,047 Spotted!
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5