So er... in other words, they are basically cutting the number of channels available to the customers, therefore diminishing the value of their service, I bet their pricing isnt reduced as a result?

Now I see what they mean when they say they are not concentrating on the television side of things, they are just aiming to make it run as cheeply as possible instead!

Digital Spy Report

There trying to get everyone to use this shit On demand service.. Flaunt was always on in the morning. Know i cant listen to my music.. Virgin you need to loose your frigging cherry and get on form...

The music video on Demand service imho is well better than any of the 3 axed channels, I can demand what music video I want to watch out of quite a big selection and its delivered immediatly without charge, better than watching/listening to a load of music that isnt my taste. tbh if I want music I put the radio on or a cd, not music tv.

I think music audio on demand with the ability to create and save a playlist would be a great idea, they could proberbly fit a huge library of mp3 quality audio for the space/bandwidth of 1 video.

iirc they are freeing up bandwidth for linear HD channels.

imho they need to axe all the +1 channels, and put +1 content as VoD, i.e
If a programme is broadcast 3:00 - 3:30 then at 4:00 it should be avialble on VoD, and at 5:00 the VoD list is updated and is replaced with shows broadcast between 4:00 - 5:00. just a thought.

On V+ and Sky+ I know you can rewind live tv, but is this only the channel you have been watching. and how far back can it rewind.

Im just jabbering on now so I will stop.

we just started using that musicon demand it well cool never watched the 3 channels they took off any way so no major loss to our house

Wrong technology Waddi mate.

Freeing up bandwidth... ahem, the bandwidth on cable should be no problem, its Sky via DSAT that should be worrying about bandwidth.

Sky have very limited bandwidth in comparison to digital cable (whether its FTTH or Coax), yet not only do they have twice as many channels, but they have 12 HD channels (maybe more) whereas Virgin have a big fat ZERO at the moment.

At the end of the day, its cutting the cost of running the service, which is why more and more channels will be getting cut.

Virgin have already publicly announced that they are not bothering developing the tv service anymore, as they have given up trying to compete with Sky.

They are going to get rid of as much as they can, then just lease it running the way it is.

They were even rumored to be ditching Liberate for a cheaper STB software within the next 12 months!!!

Tbh, I was predicting this when the PE shit first came about, its all about making the numbers look better, cutting costs to the detriment of services to attract a higher price for the shareholders...

Just a quick SKY question matty, coz I cant be arsed goin on the sky website, how much is all channels bar sports and movies, SKY+ and SKY HD, intial premium then monthly subscription?

I think its £21.00 per month + £10.00 for the SkyHD subscription. The Sky+ subscription is now free for all customers no matter what package ya on.

The 300GB boxes are £299 from Sky, but ya better getting them on eBay from proper retail sellers for around the £150 level.

Most of the major retailers selling them on eBay get them from the same supplier as Sky with the same warranty, forget the name of the supplier, pucker shit like though.

Im thinking:

Sky HD with all mixes, but no premiums yet
8mb BB, isnt it only an extra £5
what phone offers do they do, or they a phone service provider yet or do I also hae to pay BT line rental.

its all confusing

what HD channels would I recieve through SKY if I didnt subcsribe to the sports or movies premiums.

Yeah, just a note, there may be an installation charge, but go to an independent for a standard free install, and throw him £20 to throw an extra cable/quad LNB for the Sky+ instead lol.

The broadband is £5 for 8Mbps/448Kbps or £10 for 16Mbps/800Kbps, although lighter users can have the 2Mbps service included in the price.

The phone line is £10 and includes free caller display, as well as the other standard features you would expect like free voicemail, 1471 etc...

There is a Sky Talk Freetime plan, which is a bit cheaper then BT's standard plan, and includes the unlimited off peak and weekend calls to landlines, with rather cheap mobile calls, or for £5.00 per month, there is the Unlimited plan, which includes unlimited calls to landlines and also iirc, unlimited calls to 10 popular countries around the world such as Spain and the USA etc... As well as calls to mobiles of like 9ppm peak time.

Ill dig out the info on the calls for ye tomoz if ye want.

that would be great matty,

so basically
I intially shell out say £299 for arguements sake, on a SKY HD box,
may have to pay for installation, whats the extra cable/quad LNB for?
then £31pm for all mixes and sky hd, but no sports or movies
then £10pm phone line rental
2mb bb is free

its looking a bit pricy at the moment, If I break the intial premium out into monthly installments, thats around £65pm.

one last question before bedtime, this is the deal or no deal question for the mrs, can you get 4oD on Sky, she is addicted to hollyoaks and because of the kids and tea-time, bath time, bedtime etc, she cant watch it at time of brodcast, and likes to catch up later in the evening or later in the week.

If you pay the £299 to Sky, they will give you the install free usually.

The extra cable/quad LNB was only if you get a HD box off ebay, Sky charge £40 minimum for an install, but an independent will do a standard install free, then throw him some wedge to upgrade it to the Sky+ install.

I dont think ye can get 4oD with Sky tbh, it can be gotten via 4oD on the net of course, but Sky havent launched their realtime on-demand service as yet (its going to take a lot more implementation for it to work). The SkyHD boxes are currently the only boxes that will be able to work with the on-demand stuff when it is launched next year.

This is the reason im considering investing in an HD box meself, other then the fact my 4 yr old Sky+ PVR2 is too small at 40GB and with it being Amstrad, its on its way now.

Why the need for on-demand though, with 300GB of Sky+ space at your disposal lol...

currently im:
£47 tv
£37 internet

and that aint a hd tv (although it did cost £1200 new a few yrs ago)

used to pay £95 for a lower internet connection and was on c&w tv

TVoD is very important to me, coz I use it quite a lot, 80% of the TV I watch is OD. with working shifts most of the time I dont no what I've missed until I see it in the OD menu, but with SKY+ or even V+ I would have to foward think. did SKY actually launch the service where you could set your SKY+ to record through your phone from anywhere in the world, that would be usefull, albeit expensive tho.

but there always series link for the regular stuff, e.g Hollyoaks, top gear, Dora the Explorer.

SKY was looking to be the way I went till I worked out figures and realised no 4oD, Virgin back in the running.

With Virgin, once the initial £150 is payed for the V+ box (which isnt your to keep, you only rent it off them) you pay no extra subscription for HD, but Im wondering whether they will introduce a HD subscription fee when the launch some linear HD channels.

What HD channels do you get with sky if your not subscribed to Sports or Movies?

They would most probably need to introduce some sort of fee, as HD channels are classed as premium channels and the broadcasters require a lot of money for a cableco/satco to broadcast them. I think this is part of the reason they wont launch HD atm, so they can say to customers, "look our V+ is half the price of SkyHD and it does HD too" - even though our service doesnt have a single HD channel atm (iirc they only HD channel they have is BBC HD which isnt currently broadcasting).

Yes, with Sky, you can setup your Sky+ to record from anywhere, via a standard phone it would be via text, but from a Symbian phone, it is via a mobile EPG, much alike that of the actual EPG found on the boxes themselves. You can also use the web, which again has almost identical EPG to the STB software. You are supposed to give it around 30 minutes to set the recording, but on the odd occasion ive used it (basically testing it out), its been done within a matter of 3 or 4 minutes.

Yeah, the series link works very well. I used to swear by it (nowadays I record very little on my Sky+ cos it has had hardware problems recently which I think ive fixed, common in Amstrad PVR2's).

Without a subscription to any premium channels, the standard Sky HD channels are:

- BBC HD
- Sky One HD
- Sky Arts HD
- Discovery HD
- National Geographic HD
- History Channel HD
- Sky Box Office HD 1
- Sky Box Office HD 2

but soon to launch HD channels are:

- Luxe.tv HD (in a week or two)
- Channel 4 HD (December 2007)
- FX! HD (January 2008)
- ITV1 HD (February 2008)
- MTV HD (Q1, 2008)
- Ultra HD
- Rush HD

I think the premium channels include a further 2 sports channels and 2 movies channels in HD.

I know what ye mean about TVoD, it can be useful, I often find things on UK Nova or the BBC iPlayer that I never noticed on the EPG.

The only TVoD Sky have atm, is Sky Anytime TV, which is is mainly content from Sky channels, although some stuff from the likes of Living is on there etc... They cant launch a full on-demand service like cable, because DSAT is a one way system; you can downstream, but upstreaming is difficult.

James Murdoch did confirm however, that sometime in early 2008, Sky would be looking to launch full TVoD service to all SkyHD customers taking Sky Broadband 8Mbps. The SkyHD boxes are currently the only boxes that will be able to handle TVoD, due to the required hardware, this is why I am looking to possibly upgrade early next year - HD to me isnt important, im one of the sceptics that believe HD isnt the future of TV, well not as much a part of the future as broadcasters like to make out anyway.

- BBC HD <-would watch
- Sky One HD <-would proberbly watch, but havent really missed it since the loss of it on VM
- Sky Arts HD <-wouldnt watch
- Discovery HD <-occasionally watch
- National Geographic HD <-occasionally watch
- History Channel HD <-wouldnt watch
- Sky Box Office HD 1 <-depends on ppv pricing
- Sky Box Office HD 2 <-depends on ppv pricing
- Luxe.tv HD (in a week or two) <-wouldnt watch
- Channel 4 HD (December 2007) <-would watch
- FX! HD (January 2008) <-would watch
- ITV1 HD (February 2008) <-would watch
- MTV HD (Q1, 2008) <-would watch
- Ultra HD <-wouldnt watch
- Rush HD <- would watch

Is BBC HD not broadcasting atm, it was last tuesday when I watched heroes in HD on it.

It is broadcasting select content... but its not exactly a full time channel, and certainly not something that Virgin should be raving about when ranting on about their "HD service".

The reason there isnt more channels in HD, is mainly because the HD content costs so much, only bigger broadcasters can afford to offer it, especially given the fact that take-up of HD isnt that great.

More will come in time, its just a question of waiting.

HD isnt the future of TV anyway, if it was, we wouldnt all be using YouTube

on demand is the future of TV imho, schedules will disapear and you will just be able to watch any programme at anytime, with the od list being update daily.

so instead of waiting to see heores on BBC2 on tuesday at 9pm, it will be added to the BBCoD service at 6am for example on the day that it would have been normally broadcast and then be availabe to watch at any time you want, and then the following week the next episode is uploaded to join it on the od list.

That sounds familar, oh yes a bit like Virgin1. lol

You will be very lucky if that happens im afraid fella... for that to happen, everything you watch (bar PSB stuff) will be charged on a PPV basis.

Id rather pay a set monthly fee and have Sky+ at my disposal along with utilities like BBC iPlayer/Sky Anytime TV/Sky Anytime PC/ITV Player (when they fix it) then PPV on just about everything I watch... Not to mention the wonderful resource that is UK Nova! With UK Nova, I can watch what I want, when I want, where I want, all I need is my laptop and a net connection lol.

Im not restricted by schedules... and havent been for over 4 years now. The reason = Sky+, whilst all ye cable subscribers were still awaiting CR3 back in 2002, we Sky customers were embracing what is "like having our own tv channel" as the tagline goes lol.

Well some rich fookers were "plussing" in 2001, or even 2000 when TiVo launched, but their the peeps who have had SkyHD for a year already!!

Again tho, with SKY+ the same as V+, I have to know its on before hand before I can set the +box to record it. people have been able to do that long before sky+, with a little known piece of kit called a VCR, even TIVO if you want digital recording.

Virgin already give free access to a huge selection of od programmes to their XLTV customers.

Maybe so, but this is to keep you on the package, its my understanding that most of the content is sourced from either PSB (which they cant charge for anyway) or Flextech channels (which means they own the rights to show the content so include it whilst the channels remain profitable via advertising revenue as a result of Sky customers).

Atm, TVoD is a niche market, and therefore see's very little in the way of use, although it is expanding. In the grand scheme of things, cable is a niche, when we consider there is circa 3 million using cable, and 25million+ using Freeview, Sky et al.

Once TVoD takes off, cable will start charging, for many reasons, but one to bring in a revenue stream, and also because content suppliers will eventually demand it, otherwise it will devalue the market price of their content.

If Sky turned around to Virgin tomorrow, and said, right we no longer want all the Flextech channels, Virgin would be charging for TVoD content, trust me. They would no longer have a guaranteed revenue stream from the Flextech rights owned content if they didnt. But this compliments both companies... Sky arnt likely to give Sky One and the like back to Virgin, and Virgin cant take the Flextech channels away from Sky. So in this little war, its having some very strange consequences. You are benefitting from Sky customers as you get free TVoD... and we get Sky One and dont have to let you have it lol, whilst we retain the Flextech channels. I have a feeling Sky will soon be advertising Champions League exclusive to Sky One, but if they do it remains to be seen what the CC and rate card overseers will have to say about it.

With regards to the VCR, beautiful piece of kit, I agree, I am a strong supporter of VCR's, I myself archive to SVHS from my Sky+ - I got my last SVHS machine at the same time as my Sky+ for that sole reason.

But one cannot, even with all the systems like Video+ etc, compare using a VCR to a PVR im afraid. As wonderful and reliable as the technology is, its slow and very limited in many ways (i dont give a damn about picture quality so long as I can watch it, VHS is fine, my SVHS is awsome, puts out around 380 - 400 lines on TDK XP film).