A neighbour of mine who is in dire straights applied for the welfare assistance grant that is open to everyone on the Wirral ( working or not) he went to get his Visa card worth £60 for food and clothing, he was greeted by around 40 people who the council had texted to call in and collect ! Apparently, some bright spaark from the council has sent the same text to many people who needed the help.
For future reference here is the link
LINK
Perhaps 40 or so people were in dire straits.
Thats tight that. So people turned up thinking that their claim had been processed when it hadn't?
This is the message god knows how many people received, feel sorry for the genuine people who needed this for warmth and food
Picture taken from elsewhere!
Perhaps 40 or so people were in dire straits.
I find that disturbing. For just one day at one O.S.S they had 40 odd applicants???? Families too, going by the school transport comment. Just how many people are penniless?
Rudebox, the situation is a hell of a lot more than you realise, I went from £1200 A WEEK (after tax) as a construction site manager to £74 a week, at first the money in the bank helps, now Three years later I don't live, I survive, and that is from assistance from my dad and stepmum. I'm one of the lucky ones !!
Mmm same old story, when you work you get nothing. If you have never worked you get help.
Mmm same old story, when you work you get nothing. If you have never worked you get help.
A neighbour of mine who is in dire straights applied for the welfare assistance grant that is open to everyone on the Wirral ( working or not)
Rudebox, the situation is a hell of a lot more than you realise, I went from £1200 A WEEK (after tax) as a construction site manager to £74 a week, at first the money in the bank helps, now Three years later I don't live, I survive, and that is from assistance from my dad and stepmum. I'm one of the lucky ones !!
F.O.I request sent to W.B.C regarding the numbers of applications for L.W.A and also the issuing of Foodbank vouchers.
Brilliant, now that WILL be interesting .
Sent another one asking how many notifications were sent out today.
Reading the comments on Facebook - there were spats inside with the receptionist taking the flak, I disagree with that.
It seems that some 'chancers' had inevitably turned up but those in genuine dire straits who had applied did too. Imagine having no food/ fuel (for whatever reason) for yourself and/ or your family to be told that your 'application has been successful, so they turn up as instructed, to be told 'nah, sorry'..... I think that is cruel.
[youtube]l7KEuKKuuas[/youtube] Can I have your attention please??
Will the TRUE recipient of LWA23888 please stand up, please stand up!!!
Im interested to know the figures you asked about, but to be honest, as regards this incident, I dont understand whats going on - admittedly I have no background knowledge of the system, but to me it seems on the surface, that a batch of welfare payments have been 'passed'and the people have all turned up to receive them . Its not uncommon in clinic appointments for instance for batches of people to all be given the same appointment time and then just Q. Im sure Im being naive here but I dont get how we know that some are genuine and some are false? (Given that its possible that many of a similar nature may be grouped under the same reference number. ) Ah, I get it - I missed the word UNIQUE pin . Sorry
Hadnt appreciated the situation properly. Absolutely outrageous!!
Im interested to know the figures you asked about, but to be honest, as regards this incident, I dont understand whats going on - admittedly I have no background knowledge of the system, but to me it seems on the surface, that a batch of welfare payments have been 'passed'and the people have all turned up to receive them .
The Local Welfare Assistance is there to support people- Working or not who are without food/ fuel, it replaced the old 'crisis loan' system. It seems that applicant LWA23888 'award' got sent to anybody on the system- regardless of whether they had actually applied or not....
As stated, some non applicants attended the invitation
What about the people who HAD made a genuine application? Recieving a notification that their application was successful, only to be dashed?? Cruel.
For those that can't be arsed reading the O.P link- this service is available to everybody- working/ non working
I have said this many times, those that are fortunate enough to be in work and critise the unemployed ( this is the fault of the Tory government for demonising those who are out of work as spongers)dont realise that it could be them within weeks their lives could crash down around them, so to those that condemn just give a little thought before you point the finger.
I agree with Casper and Madge
Thanks Rude - Id presumed this was one of the several hardship benefits that the CH4 programme exposed were being witheld (via ignorance of their existence by many) , I just didnt know quite how the admin side worked here in Wirral . Obviously my charitable view of it being done in batches, was purely a shocking co ck -up. Had wondered if the programme made a big difference and suddenly all the CH4 watchers , started applying . The info you get will be interesting.
The terrible truth is £60 buys very little today and people on low incomes have ongoing problems coping financially.Imagine managing on £74 a week and you need a new pair of shoes or fridge.
At this very moment in Wirral there are numerous people hungry and cold because they have been sanctioned or their benefits have not been sorted. This is true of working people and people unfortunate enough to be sick or unemployed.
It is verging on criminal to ask people all to attend at the same time and subject them to such humiliation.crawling for help which is their right to have.
Very well put Rossie. A lot of people simply do not realise that the majority of people receiving help are actually in work. This is something that gets skipped over. Also when the government repeatedly say they have lifted people out of poverty by raising their tax limit, they fail to say that there were very shrewd calculations made which meant once the new levels were introduced it actually meant that a lot of poorer recipients lost out on tax credits etc meaning less money in their pocket not more. Poor income families could not get child care help yet its available to those with an income of £300,000 pa or more. So much for making work pay.
Interesting piece on the news just now, talking to those on benifits , those working and pensioners.
Those on benifits said it wasn't worth them working as they wouldn't get as much....UNBELIEVEABLE.
although i think everybody should work if they can i do believe that if your going to be worse off then in reality you have to stay on benefits!there is no way in the world this goverment should allow working people to be worse off!!
Not many really want to be on benefits and have judgemental prigs accusing them of allsorts, but really why the hell would you take a job if it made you worse off !! The government need to make a minimum wage a realistic level so that people benefit from working,
I would take a job for my own self respect. To have a reason to get up out of bed every morning.
To have structure to my day,week, year. So when I was off work for holidays I looked forward to it. Other wise every day would be the same.
I work because I want to not because I have too.
I do no jobs are hard to get these days, but I've been in employed work continually for the last 22 years in various jobs.
Starting with a few hours a week then to part time then full time as the kids got older.
I'm enjoying every minute being out there in the work place.
Even if it meant I had a bit less money I know I could hold my head up high and know I contribute to the economy with my taxes and be able to put into a pension.
although i think everybody should work if they can i do believe that if your going to be worse off then in reality you have to stay on benefits!there is no way in the world this goverment should allow working people to be worse off!!
:withthat But it depends how long poeple tend to claim benefits.How many years would you say is acceptable to be on benefits and not being able to get a job?
I would take a job for my own self respect. To have a reason to get up out of bed every morning.
To have structure to my day,week, year. So when I was off work for holidays I looked forward to it. Other wise every day would be the same.
I work because I want to not because I have too.
I do no jobs are hard to get these days, but I've been in employed work continually for the last 22 years in various jobs.
Starting with a few hours a week then to part time then full time as the kids got older.
I'm enjoying every minute being out there in the work place.
Even if it meant I had a bit less money I know I could hold my head up high and know I contribute to the economy with my taxes and be able to put into a pension.
Seems we are both workaholics Sue.Not easy is it.
i totally get what your saying sue but why the hell should people be worse off for working?and people who are out of work now have no reason not to hold their head up high as it may not be their own fault!i worked 50 hours a week for minimum wage when i got a phone call one day saying to go back to base as the company had gone into liquidation,i had no notice or anything and ive got a family with 3 kids.i hate being on benefits and would take any job i was offered as long as i was either breaking even or better off!i really dont see why i should go to work to be worse off and make the goverment satistics of getting people back to work look good!at the end of the day the goverment should have a duty to make it that ANYBODY in work is better off!!
snowhite people should not be on benefits for any amount of years as there is jobs out there but they do need to be better off or at least break even,and thats what im saying the goverment should make sure in some way they are!!
snowhite people should not be on benefits for any amount of years as there is jobs out there but they do need to be better off or at least break even,and thats what im saying the goverment should make sure in some way they are!!
Makes sense pockerchamp well stated.
Under universal credit it is just about impossible to be worse off if you are in work.
While there is high unemployment, its highly likely that some will be out of work for extended periods, the people that are less employable will normally be the last to get a job while there are numerous people applying for every job. Different people have different abilities, some will always be at the lower end.
It is up to the Government to create an environment where there are jobs, the Tories believe giving money to the rich will let the rich create jobs, Labour believe in concentrating the money on the jobs themselves.
sue good for you im pleased you have never been in some peoples positions,
pokerchamp, your spot on,
diggingdeeper i do not get universal credit because i have children they will not put me onto it therefore i am on jobseekers allowance!and i know people who have been offered jobs but when the jobcentre do a back to work calculation they would be worse off!the problem people have then is the jobcentre then know they have been offered a job and declined it so the people get sanctioned,therefore people are being forced into taking jobs that actually make them financially worse off.believe me if i was £5 a week better off for working i would jump at it but i am certainly not going to work to be worse off as that would be insane!people who say they would still go to work to be worse off are the reason this goverment are doing it to people,and to be quite honest i think they have a screw loose.
@pokerchamp - you will eventually be put on Universal Credit, or at some point it will pay you to elect to be on Universal Credit.
Under the JSA/ESA it is possible to be worse off in work, that's why the system changed to Universal Credit.
Morally, there is no reason why you shouldn't take a job that makes you worse off than when you were unemployed, benefits are not an alternative to employment, they are support for when you are unemployed through no choice of your own. I know that sounds a particularly pompous statement but it is fact, you do not have a right to choose unemployment and benefits, although strangely you can choose with housing benefits (a matter that is also corrected by Universal Credit).
If you are in the position that you are being pushed by the jobcentre into applying for a job where you will be worse off, you need to see citizen advice as soon as possible, before you are offered the job.
you really are not with the reality of how things are for people on benefits at the moment if thats what you think!i have paid my taxes and national insurance for the last 25 years so yes i am entitled to not take a job that makes me financially worse off,i have paid enough money into the system to expect to be rewarded for working rather than be worse off,i take it you have some kind of affiliation with the benefit system by the way your explaining things?and for the record i dont intend to be on universal credit as i dont intend to stay on benefits,but i certainly will not be working to be in a worse financial situation as i think this is morally impaired to expect somebody in this day and age to be forced below the bread line just to be able to say "i have a job"!
I've been over 5 years on benefits and came off them last year.
In more than 25 years I paid far more tax and national insurance than the average person.
No, I've never worked for the state benefits nor council benefits departments nor any of their agencies.
I will reword, the law says you are not allowed to choose to live off benefits by purposely being unemployed. It is not an opinion - it is fact.
Do you really think its moral to claim unemployment benefits when you don't have to? Isn't that exactly what the Government and media feed on to create sensational claims?
For one i never chose to be on benefits the company i worked for went into liquidation therefore i am not purposely on benefits,i dont/haven't nor would i want to CHOOSE a life on benefits.Im lucky in the fact that i dont have much debt but people who have been on benefits for a while and have gotten themselves into quite a lot of debt are stuck in a rut because when their on benefits the debtors are happy to take minimal payments,but then when they get a job the debtors want a hell of a lot more money off them which is why i say you need to be financially better off for working so you can afford to live and get back on your feet,after all isn't that what being in employment is meant to be for?i'm not nor was i ever implying that i would only be lured off benefits for a life of luxury or lavish life style,i am merely pointing out that by going to work i can provide as a father and husband i.e paying bills and or debts,put food on the table and maybe if i was lucky be able to afford to give my kids the odd fun day out!
If at the end of a long tiring week at work i can rest my head safe in the knowledge that all my bills are paid and the wife and kids are happy and healthy, then every single minute at work was enjoyable and worth it in every aspect,benefits only cover the bare minimal and i appreciate that in my hour of need,but to work for less than that is sheer madness!!
If you choose to refuse employment that would take you off benefits, you are choosing to be on benefits.
The criteria for the minimum income is not specified by what the rate of benefits are, its specified by the "minimum amount you need to live on" whose formulation is specified in law.
Incredibly there are still benefits that aren't means tested, but generally these are based on bribing for votes. Why a multi-millionaire needs housing benefits was always beyond me, it clearly should have been a means-tested benefit from day one.
Maintenance of a debt can appear to be a problem, however the Government has changed a number of laws which further enable debt to be written off if it can be shown that the debt is going to cause unnecessary hardship for the foreseeable future. If anyone is in this situation then they can go and see citizen advice who may refer you to stepchange or similar.
Initially getting a debt written-off can appear to be wrong, however, there are two parties, the lender is much more qualified to understand the risks of lending so as a professional has to take a hit when their decision to lend goes wrong, much the same as any other investment.
If you read any benefit letters about benefits it states "the law says you need to live on" with the amount next to it,so if somebody was to accept a job that would bring them down to below that amount then it is deemed wrong and not enough to live on.
And for the record i have never refused any kind of work,we obviously have a differece of opinion about this and i dont believe we will agree on each others view on things!
You are correct and the job centre cannot insist on you being put in an employment whereby your total incomings would be less than the minimum amount to live on unless there are some capital issues.
Most people try to defend themselves by incorrectly comparing their prospective incomings to benefits instead of comparing to the minimum amount to live on and that is how the jobcentre can ignore their argument.
Same shit. On yet another thread. Also
Same shit. On yet another thread. Also
hear hear
Not many really want to be on benefits and have judgemental prigs accusing them of allsorts, but really why the hell would you take a job if it made you worse off,
Because when your in a job it's easier to get another job, hopefully with better pay so it will take you above what you are paid on the dole.
The longer anyone is out of work because they choose too because the dole pays more will in effect never try to get a job at all.
Not many really want to be on benefits and have judgemental prigs accusing them of allsorts, but really why the hell would you take a job if it made you worse off,
Because when your in a job it's easier to get another job, hopefully with better pay so it will take you above what you are paid on the dole.
The longer anyone is out of work because they choose too because the dole pays more will in effect never try to get a job at all.
Here is an example.2 polish poeple only living on the wirral for 2 days now.They both got a job temping at a warehouse 10am till 7pm.And they have found work.till they get a full time one.Didnt take them long to find work.And it is 6.50 an hour pay.
Exactly, I had two small children, but took a temporary Christmas job to get extra money for Christmas.
Once the Christmas was over the job finished, I was then called back as a temp for easter.
Finished again then called back for following Christmas again , at the end of the second Christmas as was taken on permanently but only doing one night a week filling up stock.
In turn as time went on I got more hours then went part time.
This then lead on to another partime job then another then another and so on.
Then when kids where in their 20,s it progressed to full time work.
Definitely easy when starting at the bottom to work yourself up to more hours or a job that pays good when already in a job.
so are you saying that people like me are not looking for work snowhite?because i can assure you i am.
Not in the least Pokerchamp.
I wish you all the best in your job hunting.If i hear anything i will give you a shout.
thanks,have got an interview on tuesday so fingers crossed!
thanks,have got an interview on tuesday so fingers crossed!
Wishing you all the luck Pokerchamp.Let us know how you get on.
Good Afternoon
Thank you for your recent request made under the Freedom of Information Act.
Wirral Borough Council does not hold any recorded information relating to whether those who received the notification are Wallasey residents or if they live elsewhere, and therefore are unable to respond to your question.
In accordance with Section 16 of the Act, to provide you with relevant advice and assistance the Council would be able to provide you with the total number of people who received the message (regardless of where they reside). If you would like this information to be sent to you, please let me know.
Kind regards
Andy Henderson
Interim Freedom of Information Assistant
F.O.I request sent to W.B.C regarding the numbers of applications for L.W.A and also the issuing of Foodbank vouchers.
So theyve ignored the food vouchers question altogether , and they seem to be just putting off telling you about numbers for L W A by making you confirm you really want to know !!
F.O.I request sent to W.B.C regarding the numbers of applications for L.W.A and also the issuing of Foodbank vouchers.
So theyve ignored the food vouchers question altogether , and they seem to be just putting off telling you about numbers for L W A by making you confirm you really want to know !!
Yup. I have sent an amended one in in. The Foodbank FOI was seperate- no reply from that one yet.
They have been playing the evasive game regarding computer usage in libraries too. Said they do not have the information when we KNOW they do. Just wasting council money playing silly buggers......
i got the job and start on tuesday!
thanks,have got an interview on tuesday so fingers crossed!
Wishing you all the luck Pokerchamp.Let us know how you get on.
Congratulations Pokerchamp...Good luck in your new job x
Great news Pokerchamp.
Aw Briil news Pokerchamp.Really happy for you.
Well done.I bet you out celebrating tonight.
Have on on me
CHEERS X
F.O.I request response:
Wirral Council thanks you for your request, please find the following recorded information Business Processes can provide in response to your queries as follows:
How many people submit an application for L.W.A for the purposes of food and fuel, in Wirral on an average weekly basis in 2015?
Response: On average in 2014/15 there were 52 successful applications for food per week
On average in 2014/15 there were 69 successful applications for fuel per week
NB. The majority of applicants who received successful awards received awards for both food and fuel.
On average there were 447 unsuccessful applications per week for all types of assistance as follows:
Food, Fuel, White goods, Furniture, Essential travel , Clothing, Floor coverings , Essential household items, including bedding.
We have no recorded information to specifically identify unsuccessful applications for food and fuel.
Has there been an increase since 2013?
Response: There has been a general increase in LWA applications since April 2013
Any other information=How many Foodbank vouchers are handed out at Wirral One Stop Shops, on average, each week in the financial year 2014-2015.
Response: From April 2014 to March 2015 we handed out 2178 vouchers so over 52 weeks average = 41/42 a week.
Very interesting Rude . A profile of age groups/single/families etc would have been interesting too. Wonder how they decide who gets what .Interested to know their criteria .Hope its decided in a way that doesnt penalize those with less knowledge of using the system, and those who are less emotional /eloquent/forcefull.
Those numbers are depressing, but I suppose you have to look at them against the total population numbers of Wirral that one presumes are doing ok- although actually of course , some LWA application may well be on behalf of several family members.
A neighbour of mine who is in dire straights applied for the welfare assistance grant that is open to everyone on the Wirral ( working or not) he went to get his Visa card worth £60 for food and clothing, he was greeted by around 40 people who the council had texted to call in and collect ! Apparently, some bright spaark from the council has sent the same text to many people who needed the help.
For future reference here is the link
LINK Sent another one asking how many notifications were sent out today.
Reading the comments on Facebook - there were spats inside with the receptionist taking the flak, I disagree with that.
It seems that some 'chancers' had inevitably turned up but those in genuine dire straits who had applied did too. Imagine having no food/ fuel (for whatever reason) for yourself and/ or your family to be told that your 'application has been successful, so they turn up as instructed, to be told 'nah, sorry'..... I think that is cruel.
Good Afternoon
Thank you for your recent request made under the Freedom of Information Act.
Having consulted with the Council’s Benefits department, I can confirm that the notification was delivered by our third party supplier, in error, to 5,100 people in total.
I hope this information is of interest to you.
Congratulations Pokerchamp - may all be well.
In my humble opinion, nobody should be asked to work for less than £10 per hour.