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Government Defending Criminals Again #986735
13th Oct 2015 1:05pm
13th Oct 2015 1:05pm
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,588
Birkenhead
diggingdeeper Offline OP

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diggingdeeper  Offline OP

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Cameron is interfering with the decision of Saudi Arabia to flog Karl Andree. These actions irritate me, people flaunt rules abroad despite knowing what the punishments are and yet we have the cheek to defend them.

I would hope that the decision to cancel the prison contract is nothing to do with this case, that would be shooting ourselves in the foot.

SOURCE


The further you are down the pay scale, the more 'essential' you are when the s--- hits the fan... Sue Farbysmith 2020

Insults are engendered from vulgar minds, like toadstools from a dunghill - Charles Caleb Colton

We don't do charity in Germany, We pay taxes. Charity is a failure of governments' responsibilities - Henning Wehn
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Re: Government Defending Criminals Again [Re: diggingdeeper] #986746
13th Oct 2015 4:20pm
13th Oct 2015 4:20pm
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 3,621
Wirral
V
venice Offline

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venice  Offline

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Wirral
At his age, can we be sure the bloke isnt a bit simple or age related confused ?

Re: Government Defending Criminals Again [Re: diggingdeeper] #986748
13th Oct 2015 4:35pm
13th Oct 2015 4:35pm
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,588
Birkenhead
diggingdeeper Offline OP

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Birkenhead
Its nothing to do with us, its whatever the law of the land is, we should not be undermining the authority of another country by defending an individual who has brought our own country into disrepute.

I have no problem with our government challenging another country's policies but we shouldn't meddle with individual cases unless we are convinced that the person is innocent.


The further you are down the pay scale, the more 'essential' you are when the s--- hits the fan... Sue Farbysmith 2020

Insults are engendered from vulgar minds, like toadstools from a dunghill - Charles Caleb Colton

We don't do charity in Germany, We pay taxes. Charity is a failure of governments' responsibilities - Henning Wehn
Re: Government Defending Criminals Again [Re: diggingdeeper] #986786
13th Oct 2015 8:29pm
13th Oct 2015 8:29pm
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,426
Wirral
granny Offline
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He has worked and lived out there for years, I just can't believe how stupid a mature adult can be. I dare say he's been ferrying it around for a long time.

I do think we have to intervene as a nation against certain punishments that we consider to be barbaric. If we don't, then there is no reason why we should not reintroduce capital punishment again in this country. We are either in agreement with capital punishment or not.



Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
~Chief Seattle
Re: Government Defending Criminals Again [Re: diggingdeeper] #986788
13th Oct 2015 8:42pm
13th Oct 2015 8:42pm
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,588
Birkenhead
diggingdeeper Offline OP

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This is corporal punishment not capital punishment. The way it is done in Saudi doesn't generally break the skin, it does cause severe bruising. The full count isn't carried out at one time, its batched. It is extremely painful but doesn't usually leave permanent physical damage.

We see incidents that cause more damage frequently on our streets but we don't see any international reaction to them?


The further you are down the pay scale, the more 'essential' you are when the s--- hits the fan... Sue Farbysmith 2020

Insults are engendered from vulgar minds, like toadstools from a dunghill - Charles Caleb Colton

We don't do charity in Germany, We pay taxes. Charity is a failure of governments' responsibilities - Henning Wehn
Re: Government Defending Criminals Again [Re: diggingdeeper] #986794
13th Oct 2015 9:20pm
13th Oct 2015 9:20pm
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 3,621
Wirral
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venice Offline

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Quote DD "I have no problem with our government challenging another country's policies but we shouldn't meddle with individual cases unless we are convinced that the person is innocent."

Surely innocent OR disadvantaged mentally as I mentioned earlier? If hes definitely got all his marbles, then I wouldnt argue with you , no, we shouldnt interfere, but if there could be any indication that he's got mental health problems that arent being acknowledged by a foreign regime, then I think we should interfere. I suppose relatives or friends would have put that scenartio forward though by now , wouldnt they, if that was the case --

Re: Government Defending Criminals Again [Re: diggingdeeper] #986798
13th Oct 2015 10:14pm
13th Oct 2015 10:14pm
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,588
Birkenhead
diggingdeeper Offline OP

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diggingdeeper  Offline OP

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If he is with it enough to drive then I'd accept that as mentally competent. He is employed and working in Saudi.

He's been in Saudi 25 years, he knows exactly what the score is.



The further you are down the pay scale, the more 'essential' you are when the s--- hits the fan... Sue Farbysmith 2020

Insults are engendered from vulgar minds, like toadstools from a dunghill - Charles Caleb Colton

We don't do charity in Germany, We pay taxes. Charity is a failure of governments' responsibilities - Henning Wehn
Re: Government Defending Criminals Again [Re: diggingdeeper] #986800
13th Oct 2015 10:37pm
13th Oct 2015 10:37pm
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,868
shropshire
chriskay Offline
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chriskay  Offline
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shropshire
I agree; he was aware of the consequences if he were caught.


Carpe diem.
Re: Government Defending Criminals Again [Re: diggingdeeper] #986804
14th Oct 2015 8:01am
14th Oct 2015 8:01am
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 7,086
Wirral
snowhite Offline

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Wirral
I don t think David Cameron should get involved with this.
Karl Andree must have known Saudi Law before he even thought about drinking the alcohol.


Re: Government Defending Criminals Again [Re: diggingdeeper] #986823
14th Oct 2015 10:50am
14th Oct 2015 10:50am
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 3,447
The Rectory Eastham
Vanmanone Offline
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The Rectory Eastham
To be fair,I think they should knock off fifty lashes for good behavior .. he`s done twelve months and without a drink.

Last edited by Vanmanone; 14th Oct 2015 10:50am.
Re: Government Defending Criminals Again [Re: diggingdeeper] #986824
14th Oct 2015 10:59am
14th Oct 2015 10:59am
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,426
Wirral
granny Offline
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granny  Offline
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Wirral
Have to ask why Saudi Arabia is head of the UN Human Rights Council. All they do is beheadings, crucifixions, lashings and apparently , beheaded more people last year than IS.
So why would any humanitarian country want to make a deal with them over prison services ? Saudi seem to have their own agenda on things anyway.

He may have committed the crime and even knew what the punishment would be. The crime was wrong but so is the punishment. He has served 14 months behind bars of a 12 month sentence. Is that not enough ?

Hope none of you start defending the actions of IS, simply because it's a cultural issue!!

Last edited by granny; 14th Oct 2015 11:03am.

Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
~Chief Seattle
Re: Government Defending Criminals Again [Re: granny] #986826
14th Oct 2015 11:06am
14th Oct 2015 11:06am
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 8,967
wallasey
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Originally Posted by granny
Have to ask why Saudi Arabia is head of the UN Human Rights Council. All they do is beheadings, crucifixions, lashings and apparently , beheaded more people last year than IS.
So why would any humanitarian country want to make a deal with them over prison services ? Saudi seem to have their own agenda on things anyway.

He may have committed the crime and even knew what the punishment would be. The crime was wrong but so is the punishment. He has served 14 months behind bars of a 12 month sentence. Is that not enough ?

Hope none of you start defending the actions of IS, simply because it's a cultural issue!!

well said Granny ! I can't see why anyone would condone this punishment.

Re: Government Defending Criminals Again [Re: diggingdeeper] #986828
14th Oct 2015 11:15am
14th Oct 2015 11:15am
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 3,447
The Rectory Eastham
Vanmanone Offline
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Vanmanone  Offline
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The Rectory Eastham
I was only joking BTW .. but yeah let out,when they come over here they get upto all sorts,drinking,gambling Casino`s,and when they get into trouble they hide behind there diplomatic immunity card.

Re: Government Defending Criminals Again [Re: Vanmanone] #986846
14th Oct 2015 1:38pm
14th Oct 2015 1:38pm
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,426
Wirral
granny Offline
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granny  Offline
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Posts: 17,426
Wirral
Originally Posted by Vanmanone
I was only joking BTW .. but yeah let out,when they come over here they get upto all sorts,drinking,gambling Casino`s,and when they get into trouble they hide behind there diplomatic immunity card.


Yes, I know you were Van.

There's also a lot of drinking goes on behind closed doors in that part of the world too, in certain communities.

Last edited by granny; 14th Oct 2015 1:39pm.

Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
~Chief Seattle
Re: Government Defending Criminals Again [Re: diggingdeeper] #986877
14th Oct 2015 6:26pm
14th Oct 2015 6:26pm
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 4,036
Heswallish
F
fish5133 Offline
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Heswallish
Think Cameron wants to have a go just to try and look big after shying away from Putin.

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