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#837416 - 16th Nov 2013 11:22am Ilchest Square & Dock Cottages *****
Reno37 Offline
Member

Registered: 2nd Nov 2012
Posts: 83
Loc: Wallasey
Hi! All you knowledgable people out there, I need your help once again please. I have a map 1898 relating to the above area of North End Birkenhead and have done a lot of searching concerning Stewart Street & Tyrer Street.I notice that Stewart Street was incorporated into the building of Ilchester Square when they replaced the Dock Cottages (Queens Buildings) and to complete the scheme the New Dock Hotel stood on the corner of Tyrer Street and Stanley Road, now sadly along with the community all gone. I have an old photo showing the Dock Cottages, Stewart Street and a derelict or grassed area, between it and Tyrer Street. My question is WHAT stood on the derelict or grassed land area before Ilchester Square was built? was it houses or factories etc. The map does show a hotel stood on the Stanley Road end of the grassed area directly opposite Townsend Street in 1898, but this is NOT the New Dock Hotel. Any info or links would be very much appreciated Many Thanks Reno

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#837570 - 16th Nov 2013 8:47pm Re: Ilchest Square & Dock Cottages [Re: Reno37]
mikeeb Offline

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Registered: 8th Oct 2013
Posts: 795
Loc: birkenhead
Originally Posted By: Reno37
The map does show a hotel stood on the Stanley Road end of the grassed area directly opposite Townsend Street in 1898, but this is NOT the New Dock Hotel. Any info or links would be very much appreciated Many Thanks Reno


I think it was the dock hotel and when it was knocked down they rebuilt the Pub on the corner of stanley rd and tyrer st and renamed it the New Dock
Hence the name New

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#837574 - 16th Nov 2013 9:17pm Re: Ilchest Square & Dock Cottages [Re: Reno37]
kimpri Offline

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Registered: 29th Oct 2008
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#837646 - 17th Nov 2013 8:50am Re: Ilchest Square & Dock Cottages [Re: kimpri]
bert1 Offline

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Registered: 27th Nov 2008
Posts: 7947
Loc: tranmere
A few bits which may help.


Attachments: Viewing Permissions May Apply. Click Me
stew.PNG (10 views)
1902.PNG

stewart st.PNG

tyrer.PNG


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#837647 - 17th Nov 2013 8:56am Re: Ilchest Square & Dock Cottages [Re: bert1]
bert1 Offline

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Registered: 27th Nov 2008
Posts: 7947
Loc: tranmere
.


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plan.jpg


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#837703 - 17th Nov 2013 11:58am Re: Ilchest Square & Dock Cottages [Re: Reno37]
derekdwc Online   content


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Registered: 13th Oct 2008
Posts: 5022
Loc: Birkenhead
So, was it
firstly Dock Hotel - Dock Cottages Pub demolished
then a new build as New Dock Hotel - Stanley Road/Stewart St
then renamed New Graving Dock Hotel Stanley Road/Stewart St
then reverting back to New Dock Hotel - Stanley Road/Stewart St

ps I think I may have been the last person to have a drink and a smoke in there.
When they were pulling it down I got one of the workmen to take a pic of me with a glass of whiskey (from a bottle I took along) in one hand and a ciggy in the other


Edited by derekdwc (17th Nov 2013 12:10pm)

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#837728 - 17th Nov 2013 1:04pm Re: Ilchest Square & Dock Cottages [Re: Reno37]
derekdwc Online   content


Forum Veteran

Registered: 13th Oct 2008
Posts: 5022
Loc: Birkenhead
From some street directories
It's interesting to see the house numbers in Stewart st run consecutively and not odds one side and evens the other side [the houses on the other side from the Pub must have been built after 1916]

1861 mawdsley
DOCK HOTEL, (Wm. Laurence,) 8, Stanley road

Laurence Wm. New Dock Hotel, 8, Stanley road


1878
Stewart street,/ro7?t Dock cottages.
4 Wilkinson Joseph Bird, butcher
7 & 8 New Dock hotel, John Rimmer'

Rimmer John, New Dock hotel, 7 & 8 Stewart street


1902
New Dock hotel, Thomas Hpm'y Hughes

1916 numbers may be wrong
New Dock Hotel, 56-57 Stewart street.


Powell, John, New Graving Dock
Hotel, 5, 6 and 7 Stewa!t street


STEWART STREET
(lIchester Road)
1 Wilkinson, WilIiam, baker
2 Wilson, Willialll, bricklayer
3 Brown, JollII Willial1l. dock gateman
3a Hou~hton, Fre<leriek, butcher
4 Cash, nob"lt, dairyman
6 new Graving Dock Hotel


Edited by derekdwc (17th Nov 2013 1:06pm)

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#837737 - 17th Nov 2013 1:15pm Re: Ilchest Square & Dock Cottages [Re: derekdwc]
mikeeb Offline

Wise One

Registered: 8th Oct 2013
Posts: 795
Loc: birkenhead
So the old one was remamed the new dock before it was pulled down then?

Originally Posted By: derekdwc
ps I think I may have been the last person to have a drink and a smoke in there.
When they were pulling it down I got one of the workmen to take a pic of me with a glass of whiskey (from a bottle I took along) in one hand and a ciggy in the other


Come on derek, show us the pic smile

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#837740 - 17th Nov 2013 1:15pm Re: Ilchest Square & Dock Cottages [Re: Reno37]
derekdwc Online   content


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Registered: 13th Oct 2008
Posts: 5022
Loc: Birkenhead
1916 directory


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1916 Stewart st.jpg

1916 Tyrer st.jpg



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#837741 - 17th Nov 2013 1:20pm Re: Ilchest Square & Dock Cottages [Re: Reno37]
mikeeb Offline

Wise One

Registered: 8th Oct 2013
Posts: 795
Loc: birkenhead
Looking at that map it shows townsend st running through stanley rd and tyrer st not as long as it is now

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#837746 - 17th Nov 2013 2:19pm Re: Ilchest Square & Dock Cottages [Re: Reno37]
derekdwc Online   content


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Registered: 13th Oct 2008
Posts: 5022
Loc: Birkenhead
Reno37 Post a copy of your map if possible please and mark off the area you're interested in.

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#837892 - 18th Nov 2013 9:00am Re: Ilchest Square & Dock Cottages [Re: Reno37]
Reno37 Offline
Member

Registered: 2nd Nov 2012
Posts: 83
Loc: Wallasey
Hi! DerekDWC Thanks for your super offer of assistance. The best I would offer, as the 1898 map is a bit small, is to refere to the excellent post from Bert1 who offers a super map of the area a lot better than mine. The area I am interested in is the area shown between Stewart Street and Tyrer Steet, and what looks like a built up area of possible busines's etc. There is a bit of confusion on both maps as it shows at the corner of Stewart St, an area marked as Stanley Buildings with a building bordering Stanley Road marked as the 'New Dock Hotel' this is confusing me. Can you offer any help please. It would be most appreciated. Many Thanks Reno

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#837897 - 18th Nov 2013 9:49am Re: Ilchest Square & Dock Cottages [Re: Reno37]
Mark Offline


Wiki Master

Registered: 9th Nov 2003
Posts: 21081
Loc: Wirral
I have been told that the "New Dock Hotel / Pub" was further up the road to where it was last situated.

So the map above makes sense as it would have been the old corner of Stewart Street (Which i never know existed).

Where the New Dock was finally demolished there used to be more shops on the same side but facing Tyrer Street.

That's what ive learned been told over the years.

Over the road you had lee's Tapestry over Stanley road there are pictures about, i think if you follow kinpri's link above. I'm thinking the "Dock Cottages" may have come about due to industry over the road ?? But probably more about the popularity of the docks.


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#837909 - 18th Nov 2013 11:37am Re: Ilchest Square & Dock Cottages [Re: Mark]
bert1 Offline

Wiki Veteran

Registered: 27th Nov 2008
Posts: 7947
Loc: tranmere
Derek as already pointed out the numbering of Stewart rd.
I'm not sure what year the Plan/Map I put up is.
I would guess after than 1916.
The 1911 Enumerators summary book shows Stewart St with the New Dock Hotel in that street, the Stanley Buildings its attached to are Stanley Rd.
During the 1911 census, any industrial buildings in Stewart St opposite 1 to 8 would not have been enumerated had they been unoccupied on the night of the census.
However, any buildings there, industrial or private, should show in a directory.

Note below, Graving Dock Hotel, Beaufort Rd.


Attachments: Viewing Permissions May Apply. Click Me
enum stew.PNG




Edited by bert1 (18th Nov 2013 11:38am)
_________________________
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Come yourself,
Don't send Jesus,
This is no place for children.


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#837922 - 18th Nov 2013 12:58pm Re: Ilchest Square & Dock Cottages [Re: Reno37]
derekdwc Online   content


Forum Veteran

Registered: 13th Oct 2008
Posts: 5022
Loc: Birkenhead
Enlarged pic
Where NEW DOCK text is on MAP is where it was originally built .The pic is where it was rebuilt further along towards St James church
Is the area you're interested in the land with no buildings on the other side of Stewart st?

1876 TOWN MAP


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Stewart stm100095_329748_390132.jpg

dock hotel large.jpg




Edited by derekdwc (18th Nov 2013 1:04pm)

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