WikiWirral 13yrs online 24/7 365 days a year.
Forum Stats
12247 Members
65 Forums
72880 Topics
982347 Posts
89 posts in the last 24hrs
Max Online: 7831 @ 8th Apr 2013 4:18pm
Who's Online - Click Me
29 registered (alan128, 8 invisible), 879 Guests and 153 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Social Media : Follow Us


(Views 7days)This Weeks Most Read
What happened to Tranmere car bootie? 576
Martin Mcguinness dies 519
Alloys refurb and colour change. The Wheel Deal. 458
Need advice about Letting 409
Unusual Phone calls 398
File too large 392
Council tax bill for this year 2017 379
British troops to Estonia 341
Has anyone fished 296
1882 Plan of the borough of Birkenhead and Wards 286
New General Forums
Surely the most honest add.....
by buddy
20th Mar 2017 5:43pm
Happy Birthday DIZDAZDOZ
by snowhite
19th Mar 2017 4:24pm
My old friend the fox
by Dilly
18th Mar 2017 11:15am
charity shop bungle..true story
by fish5133
18th Mar 2017 9:11am
New Wirral History
William Bernard's building, Birkenhead
by yoller
20th Mar 2017 4:27pm
1882 Plan of the borough of Birkenhead and Wards
by Dave_Wood
19th Mar 2017 11:57am
New Brighton Coop
by Mike_White
9th Mar 2017 12:48pm
Tranmere High School for Girls 1882 Chesnut Grove
by sarah708
6th Mar 2017 8:23pm
Whetstone Lane, Birkenhead
by MoretonExpat
6th Mar 2017 8:04am
Forum Tips
Photo Gallery Forums
Birkenhead Transport Museum 24th Feb 2017
fireworks on the Mersey last night
Topic Replies
Lee and Cragg Quarries - Bacup
by Mark
33 minutes 11 seconds ago
Offset number plates
by Dilly
40 minutes 37 seconds ago
What does this all mean?
by venice
Today at 01:03 AM
Incident at Westminster
by fish5133
Yesterday at 11:47 PM
It's Broken : Forum Update
by Mark
Yesterday at 09:48 PM
Martin Mcguinness dies
by lollipop
Yesterday at 07:20 PM
black contiboard locally?
by venice
Yesterday at 09:59 AM
Port Sunlight
by cools
Yesterday at 09:17 AM
Has anyone fished
by Habdab
Yesterday at 09:04 AM
March
M Tu W Th F Sa Su
1 2 3 4 5
6 7 8 9 10 11 12
13 14 15 16 17 18 19
20 21 22 23 24 25 26
27 28 29 30 31
Recent Posts : What's On ?
Lee and Cragg Quarries - Bacup
by Mark
Rufford Old Hall
by diggingdeeper
13th Mar 2017 9:58am
Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#655285 - 19th Jan 2012 3:08pm how CAN Sherlock return from the dead?
ResearcherTony Offline
Smartchild

Registered: 28th Nov 2011
Posts: 614
Loc: Wallasey


When the Christmas edition of The Strand Magazine appeared in December 1893, it created a literary sensation the like of which had not been seen before, nor has it since.

‘It is with a heavy heart that I take up my pen,’ are the words with which The Final Problem opened — the words with which Doctor Watson announced that Sir Arthur Conan Doyle had killed off his greatest creation.

Sherlock Holmes was dead — having tumbled to his death from the Reichenbach Falls, locked in a death-struggle with his nemesis Professor Moriarty. The reaction to the great detective’s death was extreme. The Strand Magazine lost 20,000 subscribers — and fans of Holmes took to the streets wearing black armbands

Conan Doyle was less sentimental about Holmes than his admirers: the wild success of Holmes was starting to overshadow the rest of his literary output, and, as he put it: ‘I must save my mind for better things, even if it means I must bury my pocketbook with him.’

But there was international rejoicing when the needs of his pocketbook (in other words bank account), caused him to think again. Eight years later, in 1901, came The Hound Of The Baskervilles, a story set before Holmes’s death.

Conan Doyle then caved in entirely with The Adventure Of The Empty House in 1903. The escapade at the Reichenbach Falls did not, Watson revealed, kill the detective after all. The stage was set for Holmes to appear in as many more stories as Conan Doyle chose to write.

This was one of the earliest instances of a narrative device — a cheat, really — known as ‘retconning’: retrospectively altering the continuity.

Anyone who watched those old Saturday morning cartoon serials will recognise it. At the end of one episode, we see Rocket Man crash into a cliff. In the ‘previously’ section at the beginning of the next, the same footage appears, doctored to show Rocket Man strapped into a parachute and bouncing merrily down to safety.

Retconning is a staple of science fiction and comic-book writing, so it’s fitting that when Sherlock Holmes ‘died’ again in the BBC series on Sunday, he did so under the auspices of a team of brilliant writers familiar with the device — the show was co-created by Steven Moffat and Mark Gatiss, though Steve Thompson wrote Sunday’s episode — all of whom have worked on the BBC’s Doctor Who.

Dramatic: The writing team have used incredible ingenuity to ramp up the tension in reworked plotlines
So could they convince a telly-savvy, internet-age audience that Holmes was really deceased? They certainly created a magnificent teaser.

We saw, or thought we saw, Sherlock fall to his death from the roof of St Bart’s hospital. Watson rushed towards him, hindered only by a coincidental — or was it? — collision with a cyclist. We saw a pulse taken, blood on the pavement and a body being carted off in an ambulance.

Later, we saw Watson and housekeeper Mrs Hudson: sole mourners at a gravestone marked Sherlock Holmes. Finally, Watson delivered an affecting soliloquy, adapting the lines The Final Problem about ‘the best and the wisest man whom I have ever known’, before turning to walk from the grave.

The camera cut away... and there was the lugubrious face of Sherlock actor Benedict Cumberbatch, looking secretly on.

Holmes is alive! But how?

Instead of breaking out the black armbands this time, the online world and the water coolers of offices are fizzing with elaborate and ingenious theories as to how he survived.

Popular hero: Writer Arthur Conan Doyle said he had never been as sentimental over his much-loved characters as the readers
Did Holmes’s friend Molly, the pathologist, supply a Sherlock-sized corpse to be tossed off the building?

Did Sherlock drug himself to stop his own heart? Did brother Mycroft co-ordinate it from his position at the heart of the secret service?

The frenzied debate is nothing new. This sort of speculation has been going on ever since Conan Doyle’s Holmes went over the Falls.

American author Leslie S. Klinger’s scholarly edition, The New Annotated Sherlock Holmes, identifies several schools of thought about The Final Problem in which Holmes and Moriarty supposedly meet their end: Moriarty is imaginary, Moriarty is innocent, Moriarty lives — as well as ‘the fundamentalist school, which accepts that Holmes indeed died at the Falls’.

More than one of these schools of thought was teasingly courted in Sunday’s episode. One of the greatest virtues of the modern BBC Sherlock is how silkily it modernises the stories, while remaining true to the spirit of Holmes.

There’s an affectionately playful relationship between these stories and their originals.

Emotional: Watson, played by Martin Freeman, gives a moving speech at Holmes's grave - but all is not as it seems
The deerstalker hat — a feature of Sidney Paget’s illustrations, as all Holmesians know, rather than Conan Doyle’s text — is similarly treated as an in-joke in the TV version: an impromptu shot of Sherlock in a borrowed deerstalker becomes the stock Press image, much to his irritation.
And Watson uses a blog to report his friend’s doings, rather than writing for The Strand Magazine.

The spirit of their friendship has also been perfectly preserved. Theirs is a chaste fraternal romance. Conan Doyle is said to have described Holmes as being ‘as inhuman’ as the calculating machine envisioned by Victorian inventor Charles Babbage — ‘and just about as likely to fall in love’.

In the new Sherlock, as in the old, Holmes’s regard for the only woman who ever bests him, dominatrix Irene Adler, is a thing of the mind. But more important is the approach that the new Sherlock takes to detection.

Here we glory in the actions of that calculating machine: the brain that can deduce a career path from the shape of a bowler hat or the re-hemming work on a skirt; and can pinpoint a sweet factory in Addlestone from chemical traces in a bootprint.

Those who have complained that Cumberbatch’s Sherlock makes ‘unfair’ deductions the rest of us can’t — that what he does is, effectively, magic — have forgotten Conan Doyle’s original: it was later detective writers who insisted the clues should all be available to the reader. The pleasure is in the ingenuity of his inferences, more than the attempt to compete with him.

In the BBC series, what the plodding policeman, Detective Inspector Lestrade, drily calls ‘CSI Baker Street’ comes as a blessed relief in an age in which — for the sake of ‘grittiness’ — most television detectives now track down their quarries by dismantling the bodies of their victims.

Poignant ending: But what will come next for the story's fresh legion of fans?
Those lazily psycho-sexual serial killers, their motivations as gross and dull as the means of their detection, give little challenge to their audience.

Sherlock’s plots look back to the golden age detective stories that were Holmes’s legacy — when the highest achievement was a ‘locked-room’ murder mystery with few clues.

Conan Doyle’s The Adventure Of The Speckled Band — where a poisonous snake slithers in through a vent and out up a bell-rope, having done its work — is a classic of the genre.

When Moffat’s Sherlock has a man, distracted by a car backfiring, killed by his own flying boomerang, that is a witty sort of locked-room mystery itself: one in the open air.

The guessing games as to how Sherlock engineered his ‘death’ on Sunday night, and whether Moriarty — apparently having shot himself — also survived, will continue for months as we bide away the agonising wait for the next series.

Will it begin with An Adventure Of The Empty House, with Holmes surprising Watson and solving a locked-room mystery? I’d like to think so.

But all we can say for sure is, like Conan Doyle fishing Sherlock out of the Falls, Moffat and Gatiss can take him anywhere they jolly well want
_________________________
the truth is out there

Top
On The Box Advertising
Call for more Information......

WikiWirral Numbers : Between 150 and 200 New Members Every Month. With Over 3,500 unique visits and 35,000 Page Views each day. Average +500 Search Engines Daily and over 1,000,000 Million Page views a Month. Advertising from £20 . Click Me
#655287 - 19th Jan 2012 3:09pm Re: how CAN Sherlock return from the dead? [Re: ResearcherTony]
ResearcherTony Offline
Smartchild

Registered: 28th Nov 2011
Posts: 614
Loc: Wallasey
my personal opinion is that, sherlock put his coat on moriarty and through him off the building and got molly to fake the dna results, with watson getting knocked to the ground he never really sore sherlocks body properly.
_________________________
the truth is out there

Top
#655306 - 19th Jan 2012 4:16pm Re: how CAN Sherlock return from the dead? [Re: ResearcherTony]
PaulWirral
Unregistered


Remember the 'favour' he asked Molly?

Say no more... (hint hint)

Top
#655307 - 19th Jan 2012 4:19pm Re: how CAN Sherlock return from the dead? [Re: ]
ResearcherTony Offline
Smartchild

Registered: 28th Nov 2011
Posts: 614
Loc: Wallasey
Originally Posted By: PaulWirral
Remember the 'favour' he asked Molly?

Say no more... (hint hint)


yes thats what makes it so obvious she obviously decleares him dead and id's the body etc and probs manipulates the dna.
_________________________
the truth is out there

Top
#655783 - 20th Jan 2012 2:55pm Re: how CAN Sherlock return from the dead? [Re: ResearcherTony]
GrandMasterFlash Offline
Forum Master

Registered: 12th May 2010
Posts: 2492
Loc: at a computer
Aww but Martin Freeman talking to his grave at the end where he says 'just don't do this, stop it now', so sad!

Same thing happened in the second film, the Robert Downey Jr one, but it was more comical, love Sherlock Holmes laugh

Top
#662459 - 4th Feb 2012 12:38pm Re: how CAN Sherlock return from the dead? [Re: ResearcherTony]
MattLFC Offline
Wiki Master

Registered: 14th Aug 2004
Posts: 22315
Loc: Moreton/Beirut/Mobile
Well if dirty Den managed to arise from the dead (faking his own death), I'm pretty sure Holmes can manage it.

smile

Top
#662489 - 4th Feb 2012 2:06pm Re: how CAN Sherlock return from the dead? [Re: MattLFC]
yewgarth Offline
Forum Addict

Registered: 2nd Nov 2008
Posts: 1781
Loc: new ferry
The most popular theory is that pathologist Molly Hooper, helped Sherlock in his mission.
Molly, who has had a crush on Sherlock since she met him, could have helped him by faking death and post-mortem certificates and providing a cadaver to bury as well as arranging for the paramedics to be immediately on the scene.
Sherlock is seen asking Molly for help in an earlier scene when he tells her: 'I think I'm going to die'.
Molly, being a coroner/pathologist/wonder lab girl, is the perfect agent for Sherlock's plan. Aware that he will need to fake his own death, he needs to place his faith in someone who can help him die - officially.'
Of course, we mustn't forget that the fall was witnessed by Dr Watson who was speaking to Sherlock on his phone and saw him standing precariously on the rooftop.
But as he runs to reach his friend as he falls, Watson is knocked over by a cyclist which disorientates him, which would be enough of a diversion for Sherlock to pretend to be lying dead on the pavement before being safely taken away in the back of a waiting ambulance.
It has also been suggested that Sherlock's brother Mycroft was in on the plan and arranged for the cyclist to knock Watson down, distracting him from what was going on by the hospital.
Fans have claimed that a rubbish truck is seen pulling up alongside the hospital which Holmes could have landed in before making the body swap.
It is suggested: 'Holmes leaps off the roof, out of view of Watson, lands in the rubbish truck, and violently deposits the body which is hidden inside. It was Mycroft who took care of the details of the plan such as the truck and the bicycle.'
But one viewer suggested that Dr Watson never witnessed a fall because he was hallucinating.
In the second episode, The Hounds of Baskerville, Holmes, Dr Watson and their client Henry Knight, played by Russell Tovey, were drugged which tricked the trio into thinking they had seen a terrifying wild dog - so could it be that Sherlock used the same drug on Watson?

Top
#662644 - 4th Feb 2012 7:28pm Re: how CAN Sherlock return from the dead? [Re: ResearcherTony]
MattLFC Offline
Wiki Master

Registered: 14th Aug 2004
Posts: 22315
Loc: Moreton/Beirut/Mobile
I think I'll just wait until the new series to find out, which apparently might not be until 2013...

It doesn't bother me that much that I'll lose any sleep over it.

smile

Top
#662928 - 5th Feb 2012 10:38am Re: how CAN Sherlock return from the dead? [Re: MattLFC]
StuyMac Offline

Wiki Master

Registered: 24th Nov 2003
Posts: 12002
Loc: Wirralshire
Originally Posted By: MattLFC
Well if dirty Den managed to arise from the dead (faking his own death), I'm pretty sure Holmes can manage it.

smile


raftl You have a good point there Matty!
_________________________


What If There Were No Hypothetical Questions?

Top

Moderator:  Mod 
Random Wirral Images

Click to View Topic.
Newest Topics
Offset number plates
by venice
Today at 01:24 AM
What does this all mean?
by venice
Yesterday at 12:20 PM
black contiboard locally?
by fish5133
21st Mar 2017 9:30pm
Port Sunlight
by alan128
21st Mar 2017 10:09am
Council tax bill for this year 2017
by keef666
20th Mar 2017 10:25pm
For Sale & Free
Nail Varnish Stands X 2 (holds 50 in each one)
by j_demo
20th Mar 2017 5:49pm
Ipad
by madrob
19th Mar 2017 5:15pm
windows 7 64bit pc
by brady
18th Mar 2017 4:49pm
Petrol Lawnmower to purchase
by saltytom
18th Mar 2017 8:42am
2004 saab turbo 93 aero
by vw_kyle
16th Mar 2017 3:18pm
Featured Member
Registered: 16th Oct 2011
Posts: 19
Newest Members
Monkeyboyliam121, andreap, LairdLad, HollandGj, petaann
12247 Registered Users
Today's Birthdays
No Birthdays
New Wirral Info
What does this all mean?
by venice
Yesterday at 12:20 PM
black contiboard locally?
by fish5133
21st Mar 2017 9:30pm
Port Sunlight
by alan128
21st Mar 2017 10:09am
Council tax bill for this year 2017
by keef666
20th Mar 2017 10:25pm
What happened to Tranmere car bootie?
by MikeT
18th Mar 2017 6:27am
News : New Topics
Incident at Westminster
by granny
Yesterday at 03:40 PM
Martin Mcguinness dies
by Dilly
21st Mar 2017 9:29am
British troops to Estonia
by fish5133
18th Mar 2017 8:16am
Unusual Phone calls
by granny
16th Mar 2017 3:53pm
Thanks
by Christinerowland
14th Mar 2017 8:11pm
New Enthusiast Forums
Offset number plates
by venice
Today at 01:24 AM
File too large
by Dilly
20th Mar 2017 10:41am
ford focus 1.6 t reg rattling
by Little_B
19th Mar 2017 11:02pm
Alloys refurb and colour change. The Wheel Deal.
by TheComputerLab
18th Mar 2017 9:17am
Has anyone fished
by Habdab
17th Mar 2017 8:43pm
(Views 24hrs)Trending Newest Topics
Incident at Westminster 205
What does this all mean? 127
Offset number plates 42
Wirral Sunrise Sunset
Sunrise Thu 6:05am
Sunset Thu 6:31pm
Local Time Thu 8:16am
WikiWirral Can . . . .
Advertising Click me
To Advertise with
Wikiwirral Click Me