Forums Forums National News £30k benefits are not enough...

Who said I still study. I came out of 6th form with 2 A'levels, and 6 GCSE's.

I decided not to go to university - and I am currently enrolling on a uni home course (but decided this after my loss).

I never stated I was still studying, I finished studying and then fell pregnant.

I am saying that even though I am on £14,000 a year, I couldn't afford to have children now, because I can't even afford to live on my own.

And don't judge on how I would bring up my children, as that is not fair - i know a single mum, who works part-time and studies and her child is the best looked after child I know.

And yes I will be earning £14,000 for the forseeable future, so where am I going to get the benefit of working if I can't afford to live on my own or have children.

I don't disagree with you in that it's better now that I don't have them, but what I am saying is not everyone who has kids and are on the dole want to be, so don't tar them all the same.

Why is it people who live on benefits are better off than those who work??????


If people who live on benefits are better off, if you accept that benefits are set by experts and are suppose to be set to/at a manageable existence, then wages must be to low.

Sorry, I confused you with someone else, namely GrandMasterFlash, my mistake, I take it back.

It's definitely good that you don't have them then isn't it?



Presumably with the help of benefits, which again goes some way in supporting my argument, surely?



See my first comment.



I never once said that they all want to be on the dole, just that they shouldn't have kids.

I'm not deliberately being offensive here, but out government need to tell people in no uncertain terms that they WILL NOT be left better off as a result of not working. Unfortunately, they won't, and people are.

Therein lies the problem.

The experts are doing something wrong.

Maybe if the minimum wage was upped it would encourage people into work? Therefore in the process meaning less is paid out in benefits and the knock on effect being that taxes could maybe be lowered. Win/win on paper.

But a) are the jobs there? b) will people actually want to sort themselves out and get a job or are they happy doing nothing and being proxy-parented by the tax payers c) do I have a clue what I'm going on about?

But that's why I'm in investments and not an MP.

In certain ways yes it is good that I don't have them - i can't say the same for my mental stability because certain times of the year are very tough for me, as they would be with anyone else int he same position.

Yes she does have the help of benefits - but she is currently doing a course on accountancy to get out of benefits and start on a career. She has to start somewhere, and at least she is working part-time, and looking for other work.

I have mixed feeling on the subject of children and having them. especially when there is people out there that can't have them.

If these people didn't have children, what would they be doing - still sat on their arse probably? Or trying to find work - work that isn't out there?

I just don't think you should tar everyone with the same brush, because not all people that have kids want to be on the dole, but because of circumstance have to be. What happens with accidental pregnancies...abortion? Our rate of abortion is high as it is.......theres loads of questions involved with this argument......

If wages were higher than benefits, that in itself would be an incentive for people to find jobs, obversouly there has to be jobs available but thats another argument. What incentive does an employer have to pay higher wages when they know they can employ workers on poor money knowing full well that, that person will be backed up by the state with working benefits.

I understand. Sorry.



Good on her, but see the bit in bold, my argument there would be yep, but she should have started with the accountancy before having the baby...



In a perfect world they'd be trying harder to find a job and due to flexibility I imagine they'd probably be a bit more employable.



I addressed that earlier. It should therefore be a case of wanting kids but not being able to 'because of their circumstances'




I'm not religious in the slightest and believe abortion is fine and in some cases for the greater good.



Too right, and abortion isn't one I want to address to be honest.

But, remember, I read the Daily Mail which is total gutter press with a face of respectable middle england and my main aim is to become rich through corruption, raise the cost of motoring until only the very rich can afford it, then hoon about deserted roads.

Indeed, and there's an argument for putting up minimum wage.

But on the flip side, why make yourselves unpopular with business owners if there's no guarantee it'll fix any problems.

I am a skilled Engineer and I do not make £25K basic! Stop the benefits and make um work for a living like the rest of us FFS!

I'll second that, how anyone on the scrounge can even earn more than the lowest skilled workers i don't know, no justification in my eyes but to pay scroungers better than profesional engineers,surveyors,consultants and PM's i'm baffled ???

You want to get yourself over to Australia mate!

The minimum wage is going up.

It's not about wages, it all boils down to the previous Labour government targeting votes from those who wish not to work.

The only real difference between Labour and the Conservatives in this country, for the past god knows how many years, is benefits.

- If the Tories had our way, we would scrap all these benefits and leave the welfare state as a safety net for those who find themselves, through no fault of their own, in shit street, and those benefits would be enough to exist on and not much else.

- If Labour had their own way, they would scrap working altogether, as their belief is make everyone able to afford a fantastic life, regardless as to whether or not they want to work.Just keep building up that deficit bitch!

Neither will reach their goal, however Labour came pretty darn close to doing so in their previous 13 year term.

Wherever you look in the country today, there is plenty of people making a good living from benefits. I was speaking to a mate the other day, who wants to work desperately (she has worked all her life previously to having a child). She herself admits she gets too much money on benefits, and it is a dis-incentive to work. She can afford a good night out once or twice a month, fags every day, new TV's etc, the council pay for a nice home for her, she doesnt worry about money in general, and she is on benefits.

What narks me is why society feels it is okay that I have to pay for other people to have kids. I have no kids, and have no intentions of having kids - as a result, I am not eligible for any benefits. You go and pop a kid out, and suddenly a world of benefits becomes available to you. Child tax credits, free milk, free childcare, vouchers left, right and centre etc... and you also benefit from increased allowances on rent, council tax etc, and other benefits.

Did you know, just for popping out a kid, the system pays you £3100 per year, even if you don't work, and never have worked - and that's just CTC! Should you pop out 3 kids, people at the lower end of the spectrum, will get give £8220 - you wage has to go above £20,000 before your CTC allowance starts getting hit. I work in the CAB on IT support and everywhere you look, there is "benefit entitlement" guides plastered all over the walls, the range of benefits for those with kids is quite literally obscene.

I'm of the same opinion as you Alex, people should work for their money, and work fookin hard if they want extra money, kids etc... When you see these doleys sat in their homes, paid for by the taxpayer, with taxpayers money, playing their xbox 360's and drinking booze, smoking week, going out every saturday night, it makes you realise that benefits are simply far too high, and this country has it all wrong.

What was it Cameron found when got into power, a family living in a £140,000 per year house, paid for by the taxpayer? And yet Bert and the rest of his Labourites will tell you that it is only fair that people on benefits should get the same income as the rest of us, be able to live the same life as the rest of us.

It's nothing to do with wages, the problem comes down to Labour pushing and pushing and pushing the welfare system as an alternative way of life for those who do not wish to work, and make it so fookin comfortable for them, that they lose any need to work.

They also promoted people to have kids, regardless of whether you could afford it or not, it was actually to the point where they were paying people to pop kids out, the idea of getting a home for most hard-working young people is just a dream - yet you pop a kid out, and we will give you a home, and pay for it, and then pay you extra money to live a fantastic life in it - just so long as you don't intend to get a job!!

The next person to tell me benefits are not high enough, can explain why most people on them, openly admit that they are too high. The next person who can tell me that benefits are not high enough, can explain why someone on benefits should be able to afford fags, booze, consoles etc, even cars, that the rest of us have to work hard to get.

The best thing in this country is the conservatives, where it not for them Alex, you'd probably be paying 85% tax to sustain the lives of those Labour scumbags who want everything for nothing, and want to give everyone everything for nothing.

Labour needs to get back to its roots, it was setup to help and protect the working class, modern-day Labour simply helps the idle-class, the economically inactive, and the stupid folk who spend more than they can afford by having kids etc...

If you want kids, have them, but fkin pay for them yourselves, just like my Nan and Grandad with 5 kids, they managed it, why is so hard to think that anyone can't manage it nowadays?

Bert, why do your lazy barstard Labour chums feels its okay to not work? Quit blaming it on low wages and all the rest of the shite, where has your pride gone, where is you self-respect, what has happened to going out and doing an honest-days work for an honest days wage, this country has never had working regulations or wages so good, and yet you still sympathise for those who don't want to work.

How about we make a two tier tax system - those who support Labours ideology of a state will pay for everything society, and you can pay 80% tax, and those who support a work for your own life society, and we will pay 10% tax.

That sounds good to me!!

Sorry for the rant, I'm just sick of paying for other people to have kids, for other people not to have to work, working upwards of 60 hours a week to afford a nice home and be putting savings away, and seeing scroungers everywhere I look... and then watching Labourites have the audacity to blame all the problems on low wages, and try to brainwash everyone that its only fair for people to never work a day in their lives, and then leech tens of thousands of pounds of benefits a year from the taxpayer, whilst there is cancer patients being denied £12,000 courses of drugs and other treatments "because they cost too much"

Argh

13 years, 13 FOOKING YEARS.

And what did your party do to address this issue? Fook all!! No, instead, they simply made the living on benefits more comfortable than ever, and decreased the gap between income on benefits, and income through working... to the point where many people found themselves better of on benefits. So don't give us that shite!!