Our Success is in our members who value our strength as a valued community.
Forum Stats
12353 Members
65 Forums
73356 Topics
990685 Posts
21 posts in the last 24hrs
Max Online: 7831 @ 8th Apr 2013 4:18pm
Who's Online - Click Me
66 registered (alan128, 12 invisible), 1253 Guests and 307 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Social Media : Follow Us


(Views 7days)This Weeks Most Read
Captain Toni's text message annoyances 510
Tam O'Shanter Urban Farm Fun Day 6th August 437
Tunnel Flyovers Part 1 432
Flood and storm warning 351
Granny Pods 339
Who is number 13? 315
Broken lawnmower 287
Norman Thelwell -Artist 214
Tree slice cutting 197
Mike Fitzpatrick - Roofer. any good? 191
New General Forums
Acid attacks plague London, Whats really going on
by snowhite
19th Jul 2017 11:47am
Granny Pods
by granny
17th Jul 2017 7:53pm
WASPI website, pension complaints templates 50's
by Longnails
15th Jul 2017 3:48pm
Hoylake Golf Resort
by Excoriator
6th Jul 2017 5:52pm
New Wirral History
Norman Thelwell -Artist
by granny
18th Jul 2017 10:19am
Tunnel Flyovers Part 1
by Norton
15th Jul 2017 5:40pm
Where was St Catherine/Catharine Street Higher Tra
by derekdwc
11th Jul 2017 10:19pm
QE2 Visit September 1995
by Norton
10th Jul 2017 10:33pm
Wilfred Owen
by Fireblade
7th Jul 2017 8:58pm
Forum Tips
Photo Gallery Forums
Disney Magic
Umbrellas Liverpool
Topic Replies
Rising crime?
by Excoriator
Today at 12:34 AM
Police Cars South Wirral Direction
by Excoriator
Yesterday at 11:41 PM
Clutch Problem
by Excoriator
Yesterday at 11:40 PM
Nigel and Jacob
by Excoriator
Yesterday at 11:25 PM
Missing Cat. CH41
by RUDEBOX
Yesterday at 02:16 PM
Looking for Joyce Randles and family
by Gibbo
Yesterday at 01:10 PM
Granny Pods
by venice
Yesterday at 01:32 AM
Pensions
by diggingdeeper
19th Jul 2017 10:19pm
High end gaming pc
by brady
19th Jul 2017 9:18pm
July
M Tu W Th F Sa Su
1 2
3 4 5 6 7 8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16
17 18 19 20 21 22 23
24 25 26 27 28 29 30
31
Recent Posts : What's On ?
Tam O'Shanter Urban Farm Fun Day 6th August
by RUDEBOX
18th Jul 2017 9:31pm
charity fundraiser
by Dilly
16th Jul 2017 6:47pm
Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#295404 - 27th Feb 2009 1:49pm Five years in Prison for careless drivers who kill
Wench Offline

H4H County Volunteer
Wiki Veteran

Registered: 9th Aug 2008
Posts: 8616
Loc: Second Circle of Hell.
Motorists who kill while avoidably distracted at the wheel will face prison under new careless driving laws which came into force on Monday 18 August 2008.

The new offences will, for the first time, allow courts to imprison drivers who cause deaths by not paying due care to the road, or to other road users. They are designed to plug the gap in current legislation and so prevent drivers who kill walking away from court with just a fine.

Avoidable distractions which courts will consider when sentencing motorists who have killed include:

using a mobile phone (calling or texting)
drinking and eating
applying make-up
anything else which takes their attention away from the road and which a court judges to have been an avoidable distraction.

The new laws will also penalise uninsured, disqualified or unlicensed drivers who kill.

The new offences will carry custodial sentences of:

*up to five years for causing death by careless driving

*up to two years for causing death by driving while unlicensed, disqualified or uninsured.

Prior to the introduction of these new laws, the maximum sentence for those convicted of causing death by careless, uninsured or unlicensed driving was a maximum £5,000 fine and penalty licence points.

Click to reveal..
Justice Minister Maria Eagle said:

'Drivers who kill through carelessness will no longer be able to walk away from court with just a fine. Neither should uninsured or unlicensed drivers who deliberately flout the law. Driving requires full concentration at all times. A moment's distraction can make the difference between life and death.'

Road Safety Minister Jim Fitzpatrick said:

'The government is committed to continually improving safety on Britain's roads. Under the Road Safety Act we have already brought in tougher penalties for drivers who use hand-held mobile phones at the wheel and the introduction of these new offences today is the latest step to tackle bad driving and further improve safety on our roads. Last year the number of people killed fell below 3,000 for the first time since records began in 1926 but eight people are still dying on the roads each day. Where carelessness Ė or an uninsured, disqualified or unlicensed driver Ė causes a death it is right that the driver should face tough penalties.'

Association of Chief Police Officers (ACPO) spokesman on roads policing and Deputy Chief Constable Gwent Police Mick Giannasi said:

'Careless drivers put themselves and others at risk every time they get behind the wheel of a car. Despite good progress in recent years to reduce the number of people killed or seriously injured on the UK's roads, more can be done to prevent the unnecessary loss of life. The introduction of this legislation will hit home the message that driving is a hazardous activity that requires total concentration. Allowing distractions to affect your standard of driving is not acceptable and will now be more appropriately punished under the law.'


The independent Sentencing Guidelines Council published definitive guidelines on sentencing for death by driving offences in July of last year. If you wish to view these, then click here
_________________________
Sometimes Police Officers give more than just speeding tickets!

Itís hard to be fit as a fiddle when youíre shaped like a cello!

Top
Google Ads
#298388 - 7th Mar 2009 10:57am Re: Five years in Prison for careless drivers who kill [Re: Wench]
Mark Online   Reading


Wiki Master

Registered: 9th Nov 2003
Posts: 21069
Loc: Wirral
IMO if found guilty of either of the above you should
be put in court and charged for manslaughter.

Its always been the easiest way to kill some one and walk away.
Which only angers a a bereaved family.

We all know that when we get behind the wheel of a car
we can either get there safely or Turn the car into a Killing Machine.

Its a loaded gun waiting to go off.
_________________________
My Avatar images are all from the Wirral Gallery.Click Me
Wow Wirral History is coming along Great! Wirral History

we get +200 new members a month now smile

Top
#298517 - 8th Mar 2009 3:46am Re: Five years in Prison for careless drivers who kill [Re: Mark]
diggingdeeper Offline

Wiki Master

Registered: 9th Jul 2008
Posts: 10361
Loc: Birkenhead
Originally Posted By: Mark
IMO if found guilty of either of the above you should
be put in court and charged for manslaughter.


Trying not to be too contravercial (spell?) but everybody makes mistakes while driving, it is pure chance whether someone gets killed when you make that mistake. Someone can make a huge mistake and nobody notices, someone else can make a much smaller mistake and kill someone.

Some people intentionally drive badly, tailgaters etc they should be dealt with harshly

Shouldn't the outcome depend on your actions, not the result of your actions? Obviously it should take into account the likelyhood of your actions causing death/damage etc.
_________________________
In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. George Orwell

When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. Socrates

Top
#298519 - 8th Mar 2009 8:38am Re: Five years in Prison for careless drivers who kill [Re: diggingdeeper]
bert1 Offline

Wiki Veteran

Registered: 27th Nov 2008
Posts: 7927
Loc: tranmere
We can all make mistakes, whether it be driving or any other part of every day life, its human nature and that is something that will never go away. There is a vast difference between a mistake and deliberately flaunting a law that is designed to preserve the well being and lives of other road users and the pedestrian. With all the advertising which takes place in this country on the Do's and don'ts of driving no one can be excused for breaking those laws Jacci has outlined above. My only worry is the up to 5 years sentencing for taking someones life for those offences, that is surely not enough, were is the deterrent in that, perhaps those sort of sentences should be handed out even without killing someone. Because there's a car involved we do get away with murder.


Edited by bert1 (8th Mar 2009 8:40am)
_________________________
God help us,
Come yourself,
Don't send Jesus,
This is no place for children.


Bertieone.

Top
#298529 - 8th Mar 2009 10:06am Re: Five years in Prison for careless drivers who kill [Re: bert1]
Beemertastic Offline
Forum Addict

Registered: 16th Oct 2007
Posts: 1113
Loc: wirral
hmm...states have some bizaree law..homicide with a motor vehicle or simialr...which it is really.

the careless aspect is defined as "more than a momentary lapse of concentration...."

yes..we all do make mistakes now and then..we are human and the law recognises that...but to make a definitve and avoidable decision not to pay attention to the road eg "put make up on whlst driving..." thats what the law is trying to stop.

A life taken in any way such as a fatal rtc can never be replaced...
and no prison term can replace that life....but it may deter some people...and possibly save lives...
_________________________
Mustang

Top
#298554 - 8th Mar 2009 11:56am Re: Five years in Prison for careless drivers who kill [Re: Beemertastic]
Wench Offline

H4H County Volunteer
Wiki Veteran

Registered: 9th Aug 2008
Posts: 8616
Loc: Second Circle of Hell.
I think perhaps that the difference will come down to 3 words - careless, dangerous and reckless.

In the Motor Car Act (1903), the offence of reckless driving was introduced. In the Road Traffic Act (1930), there were two offences: 'Reckless or Dangerous Driving' and 'Careless Driving'. In 1956, a third offence of 'Causing Death by Reckless or Dangerous Driving' was introduced, to avoid having to employ the charge of manslaughter in these cases. In the Criminal Law Act (1977) the offences of 'Reckless or Dangerous' were re-worded as simply 'Reckless'.

Now here lies the problem! The Prosecution have to "prove" recklessness i.e. the driver's state of mind at the time. There was a Report made about this (which I won't bore you all with - it's called the North Report if you're really interested) which led to changes being made.

That's why offences relating to bad driving were reformulated in the Road Traffic Act (1991), to more readily identify and punish dangerous drivers. The earlier offences of 'Reckless Driving' and 'Causing Death by Reckless Driving' were replaced by 'Dangerous Driving' and 'Causing Death by Dangerous Driving'. There is no offence of Causing Death by Careless Driving (except where alcohol or drugs are involved). These changes were intended to move the emphasis from the driver's state of mind to the objective quality of the driving.

The much higher penalty for Dangerous Driving where a death results, has caused some debate on how far the system does (or should) focus on the standard of the driving alone, as opposed to the consequences. The issue is getting to the actual "bare bones" as opposed to the emotive side of things.

Further argument centres on whether the 'deliberate' nature of some kinds of bad driving should attract the highest penalties, or whether the potential danger should be the key issue, regardless of the actual consequences.

Personally, I can't see the maximum sentence being meted out. The maximum sentences are rarely used as it is. JMPO, but I think that's part of the problem!
_________________________
Sometimes Police Officers give more than just speeding tickets!

Itís hard to be fit as a fiddle when youíre shaped like a cello!

Top
#298585 - 8th Mar 2009 2:08pm Re: Five years in Prison for careless drivers who kill [Re: Wench]
diggingdeeper Offline

Wiki Master

Registered: 9th Jul 2008
Posts: 10361
Loc: Birkenhead
Thanks PJ
_________________________
In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. George Orwell

When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. Socrates

Top
#298587 - 8th Mar 2009 2:11pm Re: Five years in Prison for careless drivers who kill [Re: diggingdeeper]
Wench Offline

H4H County Volunteer
Wiki Veteran

Registered: 9th Aug 2008
Posts: 8616
Loc: Second Circle of Hell.
Ever thought of crossing to the dark side and doing law DD raftl
_________________________
Sometimes Police Officers give more than just speeding tickets!

Itís hard to be fit as a fiddle when youíre shaped like a cello!

Top
#298589 - 8th Mar 2009 2:16pm Re: Five years in Prison for careless drivers who kill [Re: Wench]
diggingdeeper Offline

Wiki Master

Registered: 9th Jul 2008
Posts: 10361
Loc: Birkenhead
Too honest mate!
_________________________
In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. George Orwell

When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. Socrates

Top
#298592 - 8th Mar 2009 2:29pm Re: Five years in Prison for careless drivers who kill [Re: diggingdeeper]
Wench Offline

H4H County Volunteer
Wiki Veteran

Registered: 9th Aug 2008
Posts: 8616
Loc: Second Circle of Hell.
Same here, hence I want out of Defence raftl
_________________________
Sometimes Police Officers give more than just speeding tickets!

Itís hard to be fit as a fiddle when youíre shaped like a cello!

Top

Moderator:  Mod 
Random Wirral Images

Click to View Topic.
Newest Topics
Rising crime?
by Excoriator
Today at 12:34 AM
Missing Cat. CH41
by RUDEBOX
Yesterday at 02:16 PM
Looking for Joyce Randles and family
by Gibbo
Yesterday at 01:10 PM
Nigel and Jacob
by granny
Yesterday at 11:54 AM
Clutch Problem
by fish5133
19th Jul 2017 11:38pm
For Sale & Free
XBox One Games
by rhoobarb2002
19th Jul 2017 11:02am
Gardener Oxton Area
by Guzzler
18th Jul 2017 7:46pm
High end gaming pc
by brady
16th Jul 2017 6:36pm
Spanners and hand tools
by anniebo28
16th Jul 2017 3:36pm
Candy washing machine
by conan
15th Jul 2017 12:14pm
Featured Member
Registered: 11th Sep 2010
Posts: 56
Newest Members
Mrsilent, Drew67, ziggurat1, Baldygardener, EuanAntona
12353 Registered Users
Today's Birthdays
No Birthdays
New Wirral Info
Looking for Joyce Randles and family
by Gibbo
Yesterday at 01:10 PM
Tam O'Shanter Urban Farm Fun Day 6th August
by Greenwood
17th Jul 2017 10:11pm
Broken lawnmower
by cools
17th Jul 2017 11:42am
Mike Fitzpatrick - Roofer. any good?
by yr20405
15th Jul 2017 12:14am
Published Author & Freelance Writer Seeks Work
by Jobneeded67
14th Jul 2017 3:12pm
News : New Topics
Rising crime?
by Excoriator
Today at 12:34 AM
Nigel and Jacob
by granny
Yesterday at 11:54 AM
Police Cars South Wirral Direction
by fish5133
19th Jul 2017 11:12pm
Canadian Ice Cream
by granny
19th Jul 2017 8:52pm
Pensby High School Bus Service
by diggingdeeper
19th Jul 2017 12:02pm
New Enthusiast Forums
Missing Cat. CH41
by RUDEBOX
Yesterday at 02:16 PM
Clutch Problem
by fish5133
19th Jul 2017 11:38pm
Who is number 13?
by Norton
16th Jul 2017 6:59pm
Captain Toni's text message annoyances
by DavidB
15th Jul 2017 9:38pm
Is The Medical World Missing The Point
by diggingdeeper
13th Jul 2017 6:58pm
(Views 24hrs)Trending Newest Topics
Nigel and Jacob 86
Looking for Joyce Randles and family 56
Missing Cat. CH41 48
Rising crime? 0
Wirral Sunrise Sunset
Sunrise Fri 5:11am
Sunset Fri 9:25pm
Local Time Fri 7:35am
WikiWirral Can . . . .