Our Success is in our members who value our strength as a valued community.
Forum Statistics
Posts1,030,542
Topics75,877
Members13,788
Forums65
Posts in last 24hrs7
Most Online14,906
Nov 23rd, 2019
Who's Online Now
36 registered members (6 invisible), 1,337 guests, and330 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Social Media : Follow Us


Popular Topics(Views 7days)
New General Forums
TV programme
by casper. 13th Apr 2021 4:32pm
Outside pool
by cools. 30th Mar 2021 10:06am
Very quiet Wikiwirral.
by Fidelio. 9th Feb 2021 12:00pm
Racism again
by casper. 11th Nov 2020 11:39am
New Wirral History
Moreton Shore
by monikav. 4th Apr 2021 5:08pm
2 old maps
by mikeeb. 30th Mar 2021 2:54pm
Brook St Birkenhead
by chris7777. 27th Jun 2014 11:46am
Vine Street Birkenhead
by ManxCat. 19th Feb 2012 5:44pm
The New Brighton Pier
by leelad03. 23rd Feb 2011 8:32pm
Forum Tips
Photo Gallery Forums
New Brighton Artwork
Boaty McBoatface takes shape
Topic Replies
Super glue on glasses lens
by Excoriator. 17th Apr 2021 12:07am
weekend break
by Greenwood. 16th Apr 2021 2:06pm
When Did Wearing Masks End
by Gibbo. 16th Apr 2021 12:54pm
Price Street, New Ferry
by bri445. 15th Apr 2021 1:14pm
amazon fire tv BOX
by stumpyduck. 15th Apr 2021 11:10am
Prince Philip died this morning
by daveybm. 15th Apr 2021 11:03am
Computer DVD disc drive
by GingerTom. 14th Apr 2021 4:17pm
What song are you listening to?
by BultacoAstro. 10th Apr 2021 9:35am
Joe Biden sticking his nose in again.
by casper. 9th Apr 2021 6:44pm
April
M T W T F S S
1 2 3 4
5 6 7 8 9 10 11
12 13 14 15 16 17 18
19 20 21 22 23 24 25
26 27 28 29 30
Recent Posts : What's On ?
Previous Topic
Next Topic
Print Topic
Rate Topic
When Logins Become Redundant #1071604
24th Sep 2019 7:10am
24th Sep 2019 7:10am
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,912
Birkenhead
diggingdeeper Offline OP
Wiki Master
diggingdeeper  Offline OP
Wiki Master
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,912
Birkenhead
Google has successfully run a program on a quantum computer, it took 200 seconds, the fastest super-computer would have taken 10,000 years to run the same program.

The impact of this is huge, because all currently used encryptions become quickly crackable, every system that use passwords is now insecure, this includes fingerprint, retina scans, facial recognition etc because at the end of the day those technologies encode as a static digital "password".

It would be a massive step backwards for society to lose the benefits of general networks (ie all secure use of the internet).

Mathematicians are sure they have created new "quantum-safe" encryption methods but that defies some basic logic, over time they are bound to become less secure, the more a secure connection is used, the less secure it becomes.

It will be interesting where this leads to, I can only see that multiple networks will be a solution, at least temporarily, using two or more independent networks can make things a lot more secure, this may have already been realised and would account for why 5g and the fibred/wired internet seem to be planned to co-exist.



The further you are down the pay scale, the more 'essential' you are when the s--- hits the fan... Sue Farbysmith 2020

Insults are engendered from vulgar minds, like toadstools from a dunghill - Charles Caleb Colton

We don't do charity in Germany, We pay taxes. Charity is a failure of governments' responsibilities - Henning Wehn
Google Ads
Re: When Logins Become Redundant [Re: diggingdeeper] #1071605
24th Sep 2019 7:52am
24th Sep 2019 7:52am
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,672
Wirral
G
granny Offline
Wiki Master
granny  Offline
Wiki Master
G
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,672
Wirral


What's the point of it ? How fast is everything needed ? Share's will be rocketing, and plummeting within split seconds ... maybe I don't understand, and have to admit there is no 'maybe' about it !

Just don't let them near a nuclear button, with their all new, all singing, all dancing, super fast technology. No recalls for errors ?


Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
~Chief Seattle
Re: When Logins Become Redundant [Re: granny] #1071608
24th Sep 2019 1:51pm
24th Sep 2019 1:51pm
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,912
Birkenhead
diggingdeeper Offline OP
Wiki Master
diggingdeeper  Offline OP
Wiki Master
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,912
Birkenhead
Originally Posted by granny


What's the point of it ? How fast is everything needed ?


Weren't you complaining about the speed of your computer not long ago? The idea of waiting for a computer to do anything is a waste of life, if you total up how many hours you lose it would probably be scary.

The relatively "good" guys have to stay ahead otherwise the "baddies" will be ahead and screw everybody up, I wouldn't be surprised if there aren't already a more than a few super-computers just sitting there rolling money in.


The further you are down the pay scale, the more 'essential' you are when the s--- hits the fan... Sue Farbysmith 2020

Insults are engendered from vulgar minds, like toadstools from a dunghill - Charles Caleb Colton

We don't do charity in Germany, We pay taxes. Charity is a failure of governments' responsibilities - Henning Wehn
Re: When Logins Become Redundant [Re: diggingdeeper] #1071610
24th Sep 2019 5:05pm
24th Sep 2019 5:05pm
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,766
wirral
E
Excoriator Online content
Forum Addict
Excoriator  Online Content
Forum Addict
E
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,766
wirral
Beware the hype.

Just because it can run one selected task at mind-buggering speed doesn't make it a fast general-purpose computer.

The point of the high speed is that the key distribution method - the thing that allows you to communicate securely and make secure transactions - relies on the product of two large primes (10,000 digits long) These primes are kept secret and finding out what they are when you have only their product is very time consuming. Too long for a criminal to even try. A quantum computer would reduce this time to a tiny fraction.

It's worth noting that all this applies only to the key. The actual encryption is done using a freely available encryption algorithm, and cracking an encrypted message if you don't know the key is NOT well suited to what a Quantum computer can do.

Re: When Logins Become Redundant [Re: Excoriator] #1071611
24th Sep 2019 8:35pm
24th Sep 2019 8:35pm
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,912
Birkenhead
diggingdeeper Offline OP
Wiki Master
diggingdeeper  Offline OP
Wiki Master
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,912
Birkenhead
Whilst google's quantum computer is not generally programmable, it is a proof of concept that a non-trivial algorithm can be programmed and run. The shear speed makes it suitable as a brute force attack on all common forms of encryption in use today.

Factorising extremely large numbers into primes is right up a quantum computer's street, it is not complex it just takes a lot of calculations although some short cuts are known.

There are already programmes on conventional computers to hack these encryptions (DES and AES), they are only secure because those programmes currently take too long.

Now that quantum computers are looking feasible, people might store encrypted data knowing that in a few years time they will be able to crack it.

The next planned encryption was going to be elliptical based ECC instead of prime based AES (which iirc didn't have to be primes, maybe just co-primes?) but that may need to be skipped now.


The further you are down the pay scale, the more 'essential' you are when the s--- hits the fan... Sue Farbysmith 2020

Insults are engendered from vulgar minds, like toadstools from a dunghill - Charles Caleb Colton

We don't do charity in Germany, We pay taxes. Charity is a failure of governments' responsibilities - Henning Wehn
Re: When Logins Become Redundant [Re: diggingdeeper] #1071612
24th Sep 2019 10:01pm
24th Sep 2019 10:01pm
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,672
Wirral
G
granny Offline
Wiki Master
granny  Offline
Wiki Master
G
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,672
Wirral
Originally Posted by diggingdeeper
Originally Posted by granny


What's the point of it ? How fast is everything needed ?


Weren't you complaining about the speed of your computer not long ago? The idea of waiting for a computer to do anything is a waste of life, if you total up how many hours you lose it would probably be scary.




I was not complaining about the speed of my computer in general, as it is good. It's Wikiwirral that sends it on slow motion. Still does , and it's annoying beyond belief at times. No other site, email, or anything else is one bit slow. If it went any faster it would be like the speed of light. ... well maybe not, but it's good.


Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
~Chief Seattle
Re: When Logins Become Redundant [Re: diggingdeeper] #1071669
29th Sep 2019 10:09am
29th Sep 2019 10:09am
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,766
wirral
E
Excoriator Online content
Forum Addict
Excoriator  Online Content
Forum Addict
E
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,766
wirral
Elliptic curve cryptography is, basically, RSA done in operations over elliptic curves rather than over integer fields, and can be cracked by factoring numbers into primes too. There are good engineering reasons for choosing ECC which allows larger numbers to be used making it more secure, but otherwise it's the same thing.

These are both are used for establishing the same key at both ends of the link which is then used in a quite separate encryption algorithm. They are key distribution algorithms, and it is these that are being attacked by quantum computers.

AES is the currently preferred algorithm, but it has nothing to do with prime numbers, and it is unlikely that quantum computers could do any more than a conventional computer in attacking them

I attended the conferences in which AES was selected as the replacement for DES, and although nobody could find a way to crack it, there is some suspicion that as the selection process was all run by NIST - an American government agency - who laid down various requirements for the algorithm such as key size, and the fact that it had to be a 'block cipher' for instance might lead one to suspect that the US government might have a backdoor. AES was selected by a vote by the delegates from industry and academe, which I am sure was an honest one, but I wonder if perhaps NSA have a way of cracking ANY block cipher for instance?

Public key distribution is what makes commerce possible on the internet, and if it becomes possible to buy quantum computers from Currys, we might have a problem. However, were - say - DD and Granny to meet and privately agree to the same key, they could communicate using AES without any fear of their messages being hacked. (Except possibly by the US government)


Moderated by  Mark 

Random Wirral Images

Click to View Topic.
Newest Topics
Super glue on glasses lens
by mikeeb. 16th Apr 2021 4:28pm
When Did Wearing Masks End
by BultacoAstro. 16th Apr 2021 9:50am
weekend break
by lincle. 15th Apr 2021 5:08pm
Price Street, New Ferry
by bri445. 14th Apr 2021 10:27pm
Prince Philip died this morning
by mikeeb. 9th Apr 2021 12:11pm
For Sale & Free
amazon fire tv BOX
by stumpyduck. 15th Apr 2021 11:10am
Computer DVD disc drive
by GingerTom. 13th Apr 2021 5:46pm
Wirral Journal Magazine - free
by Mike666. 7th Apr 2021 11:35am
Electrician needed
by paul110180. 28th Mar 2021 3:33pm
Member Spotlight
Mark
Mark
Wirral
Posts: 21,237
Joined: November 2003
Show All Member Profiles 
Newest Members
Diverdave, yamda13, Homegrown, Essjay05, jbusby414
13788 Registered Users
Today's Birthdays
No Birthdays
New Wirral Info
Super glue on glasses lens
by mikeeb. 16th Apr 2021 4:28pm
When Did Wearing Masks End
by BultacoAstro. 16th Apr 2021 9:50am
weekend break
by lincle. 15th Apr 2021 5:08pm
Price Street, New Ferry
by bri445. 14th Apr 2021 10:27pm
removal of TV aerial
by philmch. 4th Apr 2021 7:30pm
News : New Topics
Prince Philip died this morning
by mikeeb. 9th Apr 2021 12:11pm
Joe Biden sticking his nose in again.
by mikeeb. 9th Apr 2021 11:18am
Vaccine yellow card.
by mikeeb. 2nd Apr 2021 10:00am
Lost iPhone 8
by bangbang. 30th Mar 2021 11:25pm
E.U. And vaccine
by cools. 18th Mar 2021 9:09am
New Enthusiast Forums
Lost Dog
by kasper. 23rd Mar 2021 8:32pm
Covid vaccinations in Wirral ?
by philmch. 23rd Mar 2021 5:55pm
keyboard
by steviebyday. 20th Mar 2021 12:02pm
cheap kindle books
by derekdwc. 17th Nov 2020 11:06am
Bidston Hill Underground Tunnels Part 2
by robbo_theman. 23rd Sep 2008 8:58pm
Popular Topics(Views 24hrs)
Wirral Sunrise Sunset
Sunrise Sat 6:05am
Sunset Sat 8:17pm
Local Time Sat 6:20am
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.1.1