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Confused #1051784
24th Jan 2018 1:25pm
24th Jan 2018 1:25pm
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lincle Offline OP
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Having just watched the programmes about the disgusting state of the Worlds oceans I'm now wondering if we should be recycling plastic at all. If as suggested our waste is no longer recycled but dumped then we are contributing to the deaths of hundreds of sea creatures.So if I stop putting plastic in the grey bin & put it in the green bill will that help? What will then happen to it?

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Re: Confused [Re: lincle] #1051786
24th Jan 2018 2:08pm
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Re: Confused [Re: lincle] #1051788
24th Jan 2018 2:32pm
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Originally Posted by lincle
Having just watched the programmes about the disgusting state of the Worlds oceans I'm now wondering if we should be recycling plastic at all. If as suggested our waste is no longer recycled but dumped then we are contributing to the deaths of hundreds of sea creatures.So if I stop putting plastic in the grey bin & put it in the green bill will that help? What will then happen to it?



Depends where its dumped.. if landfill its not going to kill any sea life.

Re: Confused [Re: lincle] #1051790
24th Jan 2018 4:05pm
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Very true Fish but if it's dumped in landfill then it's not being recycled so why are we bothering to put it into a recycling bin

Re: Confused [Re: lincle] #1051795
24th Jan 2018 5:05pm
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Packaging accounts for only 30% of plastic produced. The bulk of it is in your clothes. Every time they are washed, tiny polyester fibres are dumped into the sea as sewage treatment does nothing to recover them.

Interestingly, though, I think evolution may have saved the day. Bad as it seems, the quantity of plastic in the ocean is only a tiny percentage of what is estimated to be dumped there. The difference is quite likely to have been eaten by bacteria. Plastic contains energy, and this means it is a potential foodstuff. I think its very likely that a number of bugs will evolve to take advantage of this. There is even a moth larva that can survive on plastic bags! Mind you, it had a head start. Its 'normal' diet was beeswax and it is a real nuisance if you are a bee!

I'm not suggesting we don't worry about it, but I think we would do well investigate what is really going on and understand what is happening before deciding how to tackle the problem, if there is one. A single eye-candy series by Attenborough is not a good basis on which to decide policy, even if the politicians are more than happy to jump on the bandwaggon.

Re: Confused [Re: lincle] #1051796
24th Jan 2018 5:11pm
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There will always be a market starting up for recycled plastic it just takes time. Globalisation has distorted many markets, in this case the foreign contracts have made recycling plastic in this country hardly worthwhile to date, this may change. Using cheap labour in foreign countries is always a short term solution and the medium to long term should always be planned at the same time.

While 80% of the world's wealth is owned by 1% of the population there is a complete lack of common control, greed overrules everything else. Redistribution of wealth is essential to get the whole system working properly at all levels. There is nothing wrong with wealth but sitting on money that you will never spend stagnates everything.

I'm curious why we aren't creating more forests, wood is a brilliant material and can be used and processed for all sorts of things. It would also keep the CO2 panic-ers happier.


In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. George Orwell

When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. Socrates
Re: Confused [Re: lincle] #1051800
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Re: Confused [Re: lincle] #1051802
24th Jan 2018 6:47pm
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This group on USA have got together and are making jewellery out of the plastics they retrieve. It's a massive problem worldwide even what is getting washed up on small islands in the pacific.. (all to do with tides or something etc)

https://www.facebook.com/4OceanBracelets/


I can't see that the proposed scheme of returnable plastic bottles will make a difference.( what is being called for at the moment) Not unless the deposit on the bottle is hefty enough to encourage the returns. Then there is the problem of storage for these things in the small local shops that sell drinks . Plastic packaging on certain foods is just as much a problem IMO, why do we need apples wrapped, cucumbers, potatoes in bags etc. ? (none of them last as long anyway, when they are packed that way) . Every household in the UK uses black bin bags .... how many does that amount to ? Plastic nappies, plastic drinking straws...we used to have paper covered in wax. Black bin bags might be bio-degradable, but there is surely some chemical residue even if they do. That in it's turn must be impacting on the landfill sites somehow.
It's a bad situation, but hopefully, things will change. I think India has a better record on such things than we do.


Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
~Chief Seattle
Re: Confused [Re: granny] #1051804
24th Jan 2018 7:03pm
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Originally Posted by granny
I think India has a better record on such things than we do.


The country known for being the largest rubbish dump in the world and very low pollution control?


In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. George Orwell

When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. Socrates
Re: Confused [Re: diggingdeeper] #1051806
24th Jan 2018 7:20pm
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They recycle approx. 60% of their plastic waste which is higher than the global average of 14%.

https://economictimes.indiatimes.co...s-plastic-waste/articleshow/59301057.cms


Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
~Chief Seattle
Re: Confused [Re: granny] #1051819
24th Jan 2018 9:22pm
24th Jan 2018 9:22pm
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diggingdeeper Offline

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Originally Posted by granny


They recycle approx. 60% of their plastic waste which is higher than the global average of 14%.

https://economictimes.indiatimes.co...s-plastic-waste/articleshow/59301057.cms



Which probably contradicts another statistic that 70% of their waste is dumped without being sorted. http://swachhindia.ndtv.com/top-10-things-know-indias-waste-management-woes-6374/


In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. George Orwell

When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. Socrates
Re: Confused [Re: lincle] #1051820
24th Jan 2018 9:44pm
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I think 'recycling' is a bit of a weasel word. Unless you accelerate your discarded stuff to escape velocity and shoot it off the planet, EVERYTHING gets recycled anyway. The earth is a closed ecological system. The only difference is the timescale.

I have strong reservations about the amount of energy used in our house to recycle stuff. Washing out a milk bottle with warm water involves energy, so how much is saved overall? I would not be at all surprised to find dispatching it to landfill involves less energy.

One of the silliest things was to discourage plastic supermarket bags. These things weigh about 4 grams each, and can be stuffed with groceries without breaking. We used them as bin liners and for a number of other things too before they got discarded.. Now we have a large collection of bags for life- which weigh about 30 grams each - and buy plastic bags as bin liners! A recent study found that using a cotton bag involved over 150 times the oil used to make a 4 gram bin bag. That means you'd have to use it over 150 times before any saving is made.

It was politically expedient however. It made everyone feel they were doing their bit with minimal effect on the packaging industry. Shortly after the charge was imposed, I saw a woman in the supermarket proudly 'saving the planet' with a cotton bag into which she was putting massive PET bottles of water, tied together with a sort of harness made of heavy gauge polythene! And not a dog barked!

Re: Confused [Re: lincle] #1051821
24th Jan 2018 9:53pm
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diggingdeeper Offline

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I agree, the emphasis should be on re-used not re-cycled. Things should be repaired rather than discarded and replaced, this especially includes buildings!


In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. George Orwell

When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. Socrates
Re: Confused [Re: lincle] #1051822
24th Jan 2018 10:44pm
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First, we need to reduce - then re-use, then recycle. I can see ways in which, with a little extra thought, I could reduce the amount of plastic I bring into the house. Maybe not all of it, but certainly some. Up to now I've been complacent, I admit, but it seems the clock is now ticking on the whole plastic issue and it's time to start making changes. Every little helps.

Re: Confused [Re: lincle] #1051823
25th Jan 2018 10:28am
25th Jan 2018 10:28am
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I'm not so sure about these free water points:

News Link

People stick the neck of the used bottle right up onto the nozzle, and contaminate it with their germs.

Last edited by Gibbo; 25th Jan 2018 10:28am.
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