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What universe are we in ?
#1049936
15th Dec 2017 12:14am
15th Dec 2017 12:14am
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 3,621 Wirral
venice
OP

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OP

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Posts: 3,621
Wirral
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Did anyone see the BBC4 prog tonight " What universe are we in" Hard to take in (especially after just having my brain mashed by attempting to watch Brian Cox explain time travel) --but Im fascinated by the basic idea that our universe is just another mathematical structure, and one of an infinite number of parallel universes . Not all the scientists agreed on this 'multiverse' theory , and it didnt sound like it was exactly easy to prove but I like the idea that 'in the beginning' all the particles (from where I dont know) get together randomly in every possible configuration -----so ultimately youre bound to get identically put together universes here and there. Just because you get 'duplicated' universes after they were initially randomly 'configurated' , I wonder if that only applies to the 'natural' structure of the universe . I dont see how it could be applied to living creatures. I could if they were all duplicated there identically at the onset, but theyre not , they evolve dont they, so surely you wouldnt expect any 'identical/parallel' universe , to remain identical/parallel ? Yey part of the time the scientists made it sound as if that was so. ie I will be the same in another universe somewhere in space/time Sorry if thats somewhat jumbled , but it was all so hard, my head is nearly melted! Anyone else watch and form any views?
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Re: What universe are we in ?
[Re: venice]
#1049937
15th Dec 2017 12:34am
15th Dec 2017 12:34am
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,885 Birkenhead
diggingdeeper

Wiki Master
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Wiki Master
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,885
Birkenhead
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I take the opinion that if (and that can be a big IF at times) our universe exists, there is absolutely very little chance that another universe doesn't exist.
It the old ripped paper question. If you rip a piece of paper is that always going to produce a unique shape that has never occurred before?
The "big IF" is that our universe most certainly doesn't exist as we perceive it. We have a very small number of senses and those that we have aren't acute. Eg, we can't see magnetism, we can't see gravity, yes, we have methods to show that they exist but we firmly believe they don't exist as well, we don't believe they have any substance. We choose to call these "fields" or "forces" but that is purely because we can't see or feel them.
In our little "universe" we have an absolute rule that nothing can travel faster than the speed of light but we have proof that some things do travel faster than the speed of light. That is our total naivety that light is that important, I put it in the same category that the proof of alcohol was measured against ethanol because that was considered to be the purest spirit, it wasn't.
The further you are down the pay scale, the more 'essential' you are when the s--- hits the fan... Sue Farbysmith 2020
Insults are engendered from vulgar minds, like toadstools from a dunghill - Charles Caleb Colton
We don't do charity in Germany, We pay taxes. Charity is a failure of governments' responsibilities - Henning Wehn
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Re: What universe are we in ?
[Re: venice]
#1049939
15th Dec 2017 3:18am
15th Dec 2017 3:18am
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Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,649 Wirral
granny
Wiki Master
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Wiki Master
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,649
Wirral
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They haven't even got the theory of evolution right yet. Only the other day is was disclosed by a scientist that we were never evolved from the apes, and we have always been an upright species not half bent or on all fours.
Whatever their next programme of interest is to them, it will never stop because it is impossible to discover what or how it all started. The very first atom, grain of dust to whatever was the beginning of all things, had to come from somewhere, but where ? I find that simple fact far more staggering.
I also believe we are nearer the end of our development rather than the beginning with regard to natural instincts. Our sixth sense has virtually gone, but with reference to DD, his remark about not being able to see magnetism or gravity for example, to my mind is key.
We cannot see the wind, we cannot touch the roar of the sea, we cannot smell the sun, we cannot hold the air , but our brain knows about them and retains that information. We cannot hold our memory, we cannot touch sadness, or laughter , we can see into the future, and remember the past. EVERYTHING we have lived through, thought about, done, heard etc. is retained in our memory, and where does that memory go to ? We can't see it, hold it, but it's there, a data record of our life . That is the part that will never be erased. The brain will die but the memory won't.......think about it !
We don't know very much in reality, and an excursion into the depths of what we call space, is of no consequence.If they found a form of living creature in another galaxy, they would shit themselves and in the process of scientists trying to make communications, planet earth will be falling apart at the seams to probably the extinction of all life. We are well on the way to that now. A more cruel race, could not possibly exist. They're about to go deep sea mining now and destroy some of the most precious species that have managed to survive millions of years.
There is also talk of sending nuclear waste up to the sun to get rid of it. Fire it into the sun ! They're all a load of nut jobs, who clearly continue to spend their time looking for another avenue to do more harm.
It's funny how scientist can come up with these ideas of time travel and different universes , life in another galaxy etc. and be thought of as highly intelligent. Little Joe down the road, who isn't a scientist but is pretty smart will say the same things but is classified as mentally ill because there's a 'tick box' for that sort of thing.
Last edited by granny; 15th Dec 2017 3:20am.
Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect. ~Chief Seattle
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Re: What universe are we in ?
[Re: granny]
#1049941
15th Dec 2017 4:20am
15th Dec 2017 4:20am
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,885 Birkenhead
diggingdeeper

Wiki Master
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Wiki Master
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,885
Birkenhead
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If you reckon there are more parallel universes, do you buy into the 'indenticalness' part? Can't have one without the other. Whatever their next programme of interest is to them, it will never stop because it is impossible to discover what or how it all started. The very first atom, grain of dust to whatever was the beginning of all things, had to come from somewhere, but where ? I find that simple fact far more staggering. And following on from that, the atom is only a concept, there is no such thing physically. We cannot see the wind, we cannot touch the roar of the sea, we cannot smell the sun, we cannot hold the air , but our brain knows about them and retains that information. Our brain converts what it has perceived about them into a form it can deal with then stores that information, whether that impression pertains to reality is questionable. Our brains do a lot of conversions just out of a hope it thinks it understands when invariably it doesn't. We might be perceiving our whole universe in a negative impression. What we think has substance might have none and what we think has little or no-substance may actually be substance. Or in simpler terms, what we think of as substance could be bubbles in a soup of something else, this closes a lot of loopholes in the current theories - welcome to the ether.
The further you are down the pay scale, the more 'essential' you are when the s--- hits the fan... Sue Farbysmith 2020
Insults are engendered from vulgar minds, like toadstools from a dunghill - Charles Caleb Colton
We don't do charity in Germany, We pay taxes. Charity is a failure of governments' responsibilities - Henning Wehn
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Re: What universe are we in ?
[Re: diggingdeeper]
#1049945
15th Dec 2017 9:15am
15th Dec 2017 9:15am
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 3,621 Wirral
venice
OP

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OP

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Posts: 3,621
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If you reckon there are more parallel universes, do you buy into the 'indenticalness' part? [quote DD ----Can't have one without the other. I cant understand that DD . Surely parallel is only a loose word indicating the position/direction of something tracking alongside another . Doesnt have to mean they have to remain identical, surely ,just because they started out at the same time in the same shared way. The multiverses can't all be in the same position out there (except those in another time) so each may be subjected to varying forces we may not even know about yet,which could change them( unless of course we blindly accept that 'space' is constant in every way, which we cant know ) Have to say I LOVE the 'are we in the soup or the bubble ' . Have thought about the concept, but never been able to express it .
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Re: What universe are we in ?
[Re: venice]
#1049947
15th Dec 2017 9:37am
15th Dec 2017 9:37am
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lollipop
Unregistered
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lollipop
Unregistered
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Iam in the universe of 'Lynne' it's lovely.
As it revolves all around me... Lol.
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Re: What universe are we in ?
[Re: venice]
#1049995
15th Dec 2017 11:20pm
15th Dec 2017 11:20pm
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Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,649 Wirral
granny
Wiki Master
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Wiki Master
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,649
Wirral
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I can't understand all that, DD. So maybe you can explain 'gravity'.
Gravity is what keeps the planets and stars in orbit, but where is the gravity from ? There must be more than earth with gravity, but when the astronauts leave our atmosphere, there doesn't appear to be any gravitational pull. So, what's that all about ?
If there's another universe there must be gravity elsewhere besides this universe. Maybe everything will crash onto each other one day ?
Last edited by granny; 15th Dec 2017 11:22pm.
Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect. ~Chief Seattle
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Re: What universe are we in ?
[Re: venice]
#1049998
16th Dec 2017 2:08am
16th Dec 2017 2:08am
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,885 Birkenhead
diggingdeeper

Wiki Master
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Wiki Master
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 13,885
Birkenhead
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Two universes can't crash into each other, if they could they must both be part of the same universe.
Another universe may not have gravity.
There is always gravity in our universe never mind where you are but as gravity is dependent on the distance between objects and the mass of both of the objects, it gets very small quite quickly with height for a small object such as an astronaut.
Don't forget the sun and the moon are the primary forces that drive our tides. Even though the sun is about 400 times further away from earth than the moon, the gravitational pull of the sun is roughly in the same order as the gravitational pull of the moon.
Astronauts in the space station are relatively weightless mostly because they are in orbit, the gravitational force is cancelled out by the centripetal force from their fast orbital rotation. If they stopped rotating round earth they would be both be drawn towards earth very fast. The gravitational pull at the height of the space station is about 90% of that at ground level.
On a slowish trip to the moon gravity must be very interesting, you will be dragged around quite a bit by the moon as it orbits earth and you.
The further you are down the pay scale, the more 'essential' you are when the s--- hits the fan... Sue Farbysmith 2020
Insults are engendered from vulgar minds, like toadstools from a dunghill - Charles Caleb Colton
We don't do charity in Germany, We pay taxes. Charity is a failure of governments' responsibilities - Henning Wehn
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Re: What universe are we in ?
[Re: diggingdeeper]
#1050003
16th Dec 2017 8:40am
16th Dec 2017 8:40am
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Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,649 Wirral
granny
Wiki Master
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Wiki Master
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17,649
Wirral
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Looking at the sun and the moon, they would appear to be much the same size, even though they are not, and if they were any different in the size that they are , we wouldn't have total solar or lunar eclipses . As someone else stated on wiki, a long time ago : "The moon is the perfect size and distance from the earth to exert gravitational pull that controls the tides. The earth is the perfect distance from the sun to support water and therefore life. Nearer the sun it would be too hot, further away it would be too cold." Add to that night and day ,so perfect is the timing of the rotation of these planets we can consistently calculate sunrise and sunset in every corner of this world without fault. Mathematics it is, but for all this accidental perfection on such an incredible scale, we as humans are not the greatest accident, but we as a creation in the grand scheme of things, are pretty wonderful ! I can believe that there are other universes ad infinitum, but do we really need to know ? Our lifespan is very short in comparison to the vastness of space. We have a galaxy, we have all the planets asteroids, a moon and a sun. I don't believe there could be more than one sun, which sustains life as we know it, if we believe in the 'accident' theory. Such accidents can't repeat perfection.
Last edited by granny; 16th Dec 2017 8:42am.
Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect. ~Chief Seattle
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AQUARIUM
by lincle. 8th Jan 2021 10:47am
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Toyah . .
by GaryFromWirral. 10th Jan 2021 1:39pm
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Sunrise Mon 8:06am
Sunset Mon 4:42pm
Local Time Mon 8:10pm
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