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Looking for family of Nellie Clarke Murdered 1925 #1038203
30th May 2017 4:26pm
30th May 2017 4:26pm
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BUTEMACS Offline OP
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Unfortunately this is a very sad story but I am looking for CLARK or CLARKE or CARR FAMILY surnames who may still live in the WIRRAL area. I am researching family particularly surrounding an informal adoption in Glasgow way back around 1917 (person now deceased) so no comeback it's just her children would like to know more about her origins. I did find the deceased's birth mother & older siblings in Glasgow in 1917 but after time of adoption there was suddenly no trace of birth mother & the other kids in Scotland & was sure they left the country either to England or abroad but after months of research they seemed to have disappeared but I had a breakthrough when in a whim I googled one of the siblings full name NELLIE BELL WOODS CLARK/E (not an E in name on birth records) as it was unusual and to my horror discovered the details of her horrible murder in Birkenhead in Jan 1925 discussed on this forum, her mother had remarried & moved to England sadly Nellie would have been sister to the adopted relative. I have since found lots of newspaper articles & stories on the murder but would like to find if there any surviving sibling descendants of Nellie. Her mother was SARAH ANN CARR (formerly WOOD/S or CLARK/E) from Glasgow her Stepfather PETER SINCLAIR CARR also from Glasgow, Nellie born 1913 had a full brother JOHN WALLACE CLARK/E born 1911 both of them were born Glasgow and would have been 5 & 8yrs when they moved to Birkenhead for their father to find work & at least 4 other half siblings all surname CARR all born Wirral area one sister died at 18 months after a burns accident & another sister was killed at nearly 4yrs old by a car I am so sad for them just how much tragedy can one wee family have but I believe there was at least two other surviving siblings besides JOHN CLARK/E there was a boy & a girl both surname CARR at home with Nellie at the time of her murder but their first names unknown to me, I have to break this News of Nellies murder to family so would also like some positive News to go with it so if anyone recognises any of the above details & know of anyone who might be connected or lived in that area at the time to Nellie or researched the story so might know more of the fate of the rest of the family could you please post. It is unlikely any of Nellies siblings are still alive but there may children to the siblings making Nellie there aunt, Many thanks in advance. I can supply an email address if required. butemacs@sky.com help

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Re: Looking for family of Nellie Clarke Murdered 1925 [Re: BUTEMACS] #1038204
30th May 2017 4:41pm
30th May 2017 4:41pm
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cools Offline
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I really wish you luck in your search. This tragic tale is known to most people of Wirral , it was so sad. Living quite local to where poor Nellie was found it has always interested me and they never did find her murderer did they? Lots of rumours of who it could be..It's really interesting to find out more about the family and as you say the horrible tragedies that befell them. Good Luck and please keep us informed on the outcome Bute.

Re: Looking for family of Nellie Clarke Murdered 1925 [Re: cools] #1038205
30th May 2017 5:42pm
30th May 2017 5:42pm
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bert1 Offline

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There were 4 children born and registered in Birkenhead between 1911 and 1925, all registered with a mothers maiden name of Wood.

Annie S Carr, 1918
Elizabeth B Carr, 1920
Violet Carr, 1921
James S Carr, 1923

Annie S Carr died, 1922, aged 4,
Elizabeth B Carr died, 1921, aged 1.


God help us,
Come yourself,
Don't send Jesus,
This is no place for children.


Bertieone.
Re: Looking for family of Nellie Clarke Murdered 1925 [Re: bert1] #1038211
30th May 2017 6:30pm
30th May 2017 6:30pm
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bert1 Offline

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Nellie's father,


Name:
John Wallace Clark

Birth Place:
Glasgow

Death Date:
25 Sep 1915

Death Place:
France and Flanders

Enlistment Place:
Glasgow

Rank:
Private

Regiment:
Highland Light Infantry

Battalion:
12th (Service) Battn

Regimental Number:
1600

Type of Casualty:
Killed in action

Theatre of War:
Western European Theatre


God help us,
Come yourself,
Don't send Jesus,
This is no place for children.


Bertieone.
Re: Looking for family of Nellie Clarke Murdered 1925 [Re: bert1] #1038213
30th May 2017 7:12pm
30th May 2017 7:12pm
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bert1 Offline

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I extended the search for children to 1930 in Birkenhead,

Jewel E Carr, Registered, March Qtr, 1926, Mothers maiden name, Wood.

Jewel E Carr married Christopher R Southall, 1946, Warwickshire.

Mrs Jewel Southall died, Warwickshire, 20 September 2012, birth date, 16 November 1925.


God help us,
Come yourself,
Don't send Jesus,
This is no place for children.


Bertieone.
Re: Looking for family of Nellie Clarke Murdered 1925 [Re: cools] #1038214
30th May 2017 7:27pm
30th May 2017 7:27pm
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BUTEMACS Offline OP
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Many thanks Cools for your kind reply it is encouraging to know there is still interest in this story & therefore may lead to some useful info I must say in all my years doing genealogy & family History for many family & friends I have never come across such an interesting but horrific & sad discovery many thanks for your wishes of luck & I surely will keep you updated. Greetings from Glasgow. grin

Re: Looking for family of Nellie Clarke Murdered 1925 [Re: bert1] #1038215
30th May 2017 7:37pm
30th May 2017 7:37pm
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BUTEMACS Offline OP
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Hi bert1 this is absolutely fantastic information & exactly what I was looking for can't believe you have responded & given me info I have been months searching for, I have been able to gather a lot on the family here in Scotland but didn't have the resources to check English records so readily as it gets very expensive so can't thank you enough you are truly a star, thank goodness I found this forum its brilliant! grin

Re: Looking for family of Nellie Clarke Murdered 1925 [Re: bert1] #1038218
30th May 2017 7:40pm
30th May 2017 7:40pm
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BUTEMACS Offline OP
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Yes this is Nellies father I only had some of this info so thanks once again very helpful. also great info on last sibling thumbsup

Last edited by BUTEMACS; 30th May 2017 7:43pm.
Re: Looking for family of Nellie Clarke Murdered 1925 [Re: BUTEMACS] #1038225
30th May 2017 7:50pm
30th May 2017 7:50pm
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Bertione you have given me lots to investigate further & add to my files thanks a million,looks like a busy evening for me.

Re: Looking for family of Nellie Clarke Murdered 1925 [Re: BUTEMACS] #1038250
30th May 2017 10:54pm
30th May 2017 10:54pm
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granny Offline
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BUTEMACS, such a sad story. I hope you can piece everything together.

Have you seen this from the National Archives. You might have to write off for a copy.

http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C1257654



Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
~Chief Seattle
Re: Looking for family of Nellie Clarke Murdered 1925 [Re: granny] #1038256
31st May 2017 6:22am
31st May 2017 6:22am
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bert1 Offline

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Peter Sinclair Carr, born 17 July 1891, Anderston Lanark.
Father, James Stevenson Carr
Mother, Annie Sinclair Carr.

It's likely 2 of the children were named after their grandparents.

Sarah Ann Wood married John Wallace Clark, 1910, Goven.

However, there doesn't appear to be a marriage between Sarah Ann Clark/Wood and Peter Sinclair Carr.

There's a death registered in Birkenhead,

Peter S Carr, birth Abt, 1892, died, June Qtr, 1932.


God help us,
Come yourself,
Don't send Jesus,
This is no place for children.


Bertieone.
Re: Looking for family of Nellie Clarke Murdered 1925 [Re: granny] #1038264
31st May 2017 10:15am
31st May 2017 10:15am
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Thanks very much Granny I think I will have to write off for a copy of this thanks for your help, much appreciated.

Re: Looking for family of Nellie Clarke Murdered 1925 [Re: bert1] #1038267
31st May 2017 10:36am
31st May 2017 10:36am
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Thanks again Bert1 thumbsup you have been a great help & I found the marriage for Sarah & Peter on Scotlands people website they married in Calton Glasgow in April 1918. I have subscription with Scotlands people & Genes reunited & have just subscribed to find my past to search more on the info you gave me for the Carr siblings & on the English records but I find some records are on some sites & not on others possibly name variations or been transcribed wrong so I'm jumping from site to site, grin it's a pity the English records don't give much info online unless you buy the certificate where as there is a lot to view on Scotland site so much easier to find details of parents etc. I will just get as much as I can done up here in Scotland then probably need to have a wee visit down to Birkenhead to see for myself, I have been to nearby Liverpool a couple of times but before I knew of the family connection to the area. Suggestions of places in the wirral that might hold records of use would be appreciated. laugh

Last edited by BUTEMACS; 31st May 2017 10:38am.
Re: Looking for family of Nellie Clarke Murdered 1925 [Re: BUTEMACS] #1038272
31st May 2017 11:07am
31st May 2017 11:07am
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Posts: 16,600
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granny Offline
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http://birkenheadtimes.awardspace.com/nelly_9.htm

One thing that I came across last night was this above linked article. Now I don't know who wrote it in relation to journalist or student, or even if it's all completely correct, but that is not too important atm. At the bottom of the page it shows an image of Nellie's Grave. Maybe it is or maybe it isn't.

That really made me upset. Poor little Nellie, no visitors ,maybe not even a stone as times were hard in those days. It would be nice for you to find where she rests.

Birkenhead Archives : https://www.wirral.gov.uk/libraries...service/visiting-wirral-archives-service

It is most definitely worth giving them a call first, to arrange an appointment as if they need to bring anything from the vaults they may need a day or two. They were always very helpful there.


Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
~Chief Seattle
Re: Looking for family of Nellie Clarke Murdered 1925 [Re: BUTEMACS] #1038273
31st May 2017 11:07am
31st May 2017 11:07am
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bert1 Offline

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Thanks Bute,

I notice they dropped their middle names for the marriage.

Unfortunately, depending on what time period it is we have to buy certificates to advance, some sites help fiddle a way through, https://www.freebmd.org.uk/ but only certificates can confirm findings are correct.

Do you know the religions of Peter and Sarah Ann?


God help us,
Come yourself,
Don't send Jesus,
This is no place for children.


Bertieone.
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