Our Success is in our members who value our strength as a valued community.
Forum Statistics
Forums65
Topics76,360
Posts1,033,313
Members14,578
Most Online16,551
Feb 2nd, 2024
Who's Online Now
13 members (3 invisible), 10,223 guests, and 431 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Top Posters
sunnyside 45,164
MattLFC 22,315
Mark 21,269
granny 17,788
_Ste_ 16,345
Newest Members
PaulRobson, meolswanderer, Firminafirm, YesterYearGenea, Luke121
14,578 Registered Users
New General Forums
Hi to everyone
by PaulRobson - 15th Apr 2024 1:18pm
Last person to post wins...
by GaryB - 9th Oct 2007 9:15pm
New Wirral History
Moreton History
by IanFife - 1st Apr 2024 1:03pm
Campbell Terrace, behind old St. Andrew's Church on Conway
by KimTheilmann1 - 31st Mar 2024 3:34pm
Tall Brick Chimneys
by diggingdeeper - 16th Mar 2024 12:56pm
Through the Window: GWR Paddington to Birkenhead
by yoller - 16th Aug 2017 7:09pm
Old Hall in Higher Bebington
by Rhoobarb - 25th May 2010 6:55pm
Top Posters(30 Days)
bert1 5
casper 4
Topic Replies
Car paint jobs
by PaulRobson - 15th Apr 2024 9:54pm
Hi to everyone
by PaulRobson - 15th Apr 2024 1:18pm
Traffic Wardens
by diggingdeeper - 14th Apr 2024 2:42pm
West Kirby flood defences
by Excoriator - 13th Apr 2024 3:35pm
Lost river (Well, brook really)
by diggingdeeper - 10th Apr 2024 11:00pm
Any Decent Restaurant Open On a Mon Evening.
by Abakumss - 8th Apr 2024 9:04am
Paddle Steamer Waverley
by casper - 6th Apr 2024 9:09am
Wirral waters
by casper - 6th Apr 2024 9:07am
Through the Window: GWR Paddington to Birkenhead
by hootmeil - 4th Apr 2024 1:15pm
April
M T W T F S S
1 2 3 4 5 6 7
8 9 10 11 12 13 14
15 16 17 18 19 20 21
22 23 24 25 26 27 28
29 30
Top Likes Received (30 Days)
Kylix 1
casper 1
cools 1
Top Likes Received
bert1 14
casper 4
Mark 4
granny 3
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
#1016778 10th Aug 2016 2:34pm
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,868
Forum Veteran
OP Offline
Forum Veteran
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,868
After the war, when Birkenhead had suffered quite a bit of bomb damage, allied to the fact that at that time there was a lot of poor quality housing, the Corporation commissioned a grand plan for the re-development of the town.
I'm fortunate to have a mint copy of this book, still in its slip case and with the complete map which measures about three feet square and lives in a pocket at the end of the book. The book itself is large, measuring about 12" x 10".
Here's a taste of the book.

Attached Images
P1000258.jpg (520.63 KB, 69 downloads)
Front cover
P1000259.jpg (519.11 KB, 69 downloads)
Contents
P1000260.jpg (517.5 KB, 69 downloads)
List of appendices
P1000261.jpg (513.88 KB, 69 downloads)
More contents
P1000262.jpg (532.8 KB, 69 downloads)
More contents
P1000264.jpg (527.17 KB, 69 downloads)
Foreword
P1000265.jpg (512.79 KB, 69 downloads)
Map in its pocket
P1000252.jpg (559.92 KB, 69 downloads)
Title page
P1000257.jpg (541.62 KB, 69 downloads)
Interesting insight into ferry use.
P1000256.jpg (514.75 KB, 70 downloads)
A section of the map.
P1000254.jpg (536.21 KB, 69 downloads)
This, and the next two, are some of the ideas. There are so many like this that I just can't show them all.
P1000255.jpg (522.79 KB, 69 downloads)
P1000253.JPG (517.3 KB, 69 downloads)

Carpe diem.
Google Ads
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,630
Forum Addict
Offline
Forum Addict
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,630
Very interesting regarding ferry services
Them ferry service numbers are staggering, considering the other options of the railway and the Mersey tunnel
Regarding 'G'. Why was the ferry still used for motor vehicles?
Was it cheaper than a passage through the tunnel?

Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,868
Forum Veteran
OP Offline
Forum Veteran
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,868
Originally Posted by mikeeb
Very interesting regarding ferry services
Them ferry service numbers are staggering, considering the other options of the railway and the Mersey tunnel
Regarding 'G'. Why was the ferry still used for motor vehicles?
Was it cheaper than a passage through the tunnel?

As it says , 40% was horse drawn traffic which was not allowed in the tunnel; also I suspect there would have been quite a few drivers who would have felt nervous in a long underwater tunnel. According to the schedule at 'G', only 15% was private cars.
As far as cost goes, I can't find out what the toll for a car was when the tunnel opened, all I can find out is that the goods ferry toll in 1905 for a four seater car was 1 shilling: using the relative RPI, that equals nearly five pounds today. Larger cars were charged between 1/6d and 3 shillings. The tunnel toll for a car in 1971 was 10p.
The luggage boats finished in 1941.


Carpe diem.
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,868
Forum Veteran
OP Offline
Forum Veteran
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,868
If anyone's interested, there's a copy of the 1947 Plan in the archives, or at least there was when the archives were in the Town Hall.


Carpe diem.
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,630
Forum Addict
Offline
Forum Addict
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,630
Originally Posted by chriskay
Originally Posted by mikeeb
Very interesting regarding ferry services
Them ferry service numbers are staggering, considering the other options of the railway and the Mersey tunnel
Regarding 'G'. Why was the ferry still used for motor vehicles?
Was it cheaper than a passage through the tunnel?

As it says , 40% was horse drawn traffic which was not allowed in the tunnel; also I suspect there would have been quite a few drivers who would have felt nervous in a long underwater tunnel. According to the schedule at 'G', only 15% was private cars.
As far as cost goes, I can't find out what the toll for a car was when the tunnel opened, all I can find out is that the goods ferry toll in 1905 for a four seater car was 1 shilling: using the relative RPI, that equals nearly five pounds today. Larger cars were charged between 1/6d and 3 shillings. The tunnel toll for a car in 1971 was 10p.
The luggage boats finished in 1941.


I got the 40% horse drawn traffic
My question was "Why was the ferry still used for motor vehicles?"
If you take into account the scared commuters not wanting to travel through the tunnel, (I suppose it was like flying a plane when the tunnel opened) it is still a staggering number crossing the Mersey on a motor vehicle via a boat, when in fact the tunnel had already been opened for over 10 years
Don't you think it is a bit high?

mikeeb #1016973 11th Aug 2016 10:29pm
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,868
Forum Veteran
OP Offline
Forum Veteran
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,868
If you allow that only 15% of the total was commuters, travelling five days a week, that's only 35 cars a day, which is a tiny number compared with those using the tunnel. By the same token, many commuters chose to continue to use the ferries even after the Mersey Railway was electrified and therefore made more pleasant. I guess people just thought it made a pleasant start to the day.


Carpe diem.
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,630
Forum Addict
Offline
Forum Addict
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,630
I must be missing something here Chris
30% is motor traffic between liverpool and Birkenhead docks
16% Petrol transport from Ellesmere Port and North Country
That is what is confusing me, the above figures
The remanding 15% is what you are referring to, yes?


mikeeb #1017044 12th Aug 2016 10:40am
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,868
Forum Veteran
OP Offline
Forum Veteran
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,868
Originally Posted by mikeeb
I must be missing something here Chris
30% is motor traffic between liverpool and Birkenhead docks
16% Petrol transport from Ellesmere Port and North Country
That is what is confusing me, the above figures
The remanding 15% is what you are referring to, yes?

Yes, I'm considering only what might be termed commuter traffic.


Carpe diem.

Moderated by  Mod 

Link Copied to Clipboard
Random Wirral Images

Click to View Topic.
Newest Topics
Car paint jobs
by PaulRobson - 15th Apr 2024 9:54pm
Hi to everyone
by PaulRobson - 15th Apr 2024 1:18pm
Traffic Wardens
by Excoriator - 11th Apr 2024 4:11pm
West Kirby flood defences
by Excoriator - 10th Apr 2024 10:45pm
Paddle Steamer Waverley
by diggingdeeper - 5th Apr 2024 7:57am
For Sale & Free
Wisper electric bike. 36v .
by Dilly - 21st Mar 2024 8:36pm
This is Elvis
by GingerTom - 17th Mar 2024 3:37pm
Member Spotlight
Gibbo
Gibbo
Formby
Posts: 2,283
Joined: December 2010
Today's Birthdays
There are no members with birthdays on this day.
New Wirral Info
Traffic Wardens
by Excoriator - 11th Apr 2024 4:11pm
Paddle Steamer Waverley
by diggingdeeper - 5th Apr 2024 7:57am
Wirral waters
by casper - 2nd Apr 2024 11:32am
Facial recognition coming in supermarkets?
by Excoriator - 27th Mar 2024 11:52am
Hot Spot Chippie Broadway
by Excoriator - 26th Mar 2024 8:57pm
News : New Topics
West Kirby flood defences
by Excoriator - 10th Apr 2024 10:45pm
Lost river (Well, brook really)
by Excoriator - 10th Sep 2019 9:50am
New Enthusiast Forums
Car paint jobs
by PaulRobson - 15th Apr 2024 9:54pm
Netflix 3 Body Problem.
by BultacoAstro - 22nd Mar 2024 9:04am
Any Decent Restaurant Open On a Mon Evening.
by Uffda - 21st Oct 2012 7:16pm
What song are you listening to?
by - 24th Jun 2007 10:06am
Popular Topics(Views)
5,071,111 WIKI WALK CHAT
4,017,095 Spotted!
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5