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Poll : The E.U. What do we want? #1000029
3rd Feb 2016 6:44pm
3rd Feb 2016 6:44pm
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palemoon Offline OP
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Make your choice
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Votes accepted starting: 3rd Feb 2016 6:44pm
You must vote before you can view the results of this poll.
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Re: Poll : The E.U. What do we want? [Re: palemoon] #1000041
3rd Feb 2016 7:30pm
3rd Feb 2016 7:30pm
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palemoon Offline OP
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I never have and probably never will vote UKIP but tonight I watched their Party Political Broadcast at tea-time on ITV.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nnrFddSJWsk

It helped me make up my mind.


Re: Poll : The E.U. What do we want? [Re: palemoon] #1000050
3rd Feb 2016 8:23pm
3rd Feb 2016 8:23pm
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diggingdeeper Offline

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Not forgetting that Turkey has been offered some back door deals to get into Europe in exchange for co-operating with our attacks on the middle east.

There is no way that Turkey could meet the entry requirements for Europe inside the next 25 years but could well happen regardless. The same happened with Greece and look what has happened there, Greece's government are at the beck and call of Germany.

I vote unreservedly UKIP in the European elections but its not a party I want to run our country, however if it came to a choice between Liberals, Green Peace, Conservatives and UKIP, I would put UKIP in parliament. The UKIP May 2015 helps explain my decision HERE, at least UKIP are realists.


In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. George Orwell

We should judge our economy by the absence of poverty, not the number of billionaires - Jeremy Corbyn
Re: Poll : The E.U. What do we want? [Re: palemoon] #1000059
3rd Feb 2016 9:28pm
3rd Feb 2016 9:28pm
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granny Offline
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Did anyone see Frank Fields interview on tv today? He spoke a lot of sense. Not really criticizing Mr Cameron, but putting forward certain changes that should also be made to secure our sovereignty. He was very interesting to listen to and made points in easy to understand explanations.

Going on what he said, I think there is so much more that must be dealt with including having our own Supreme Court, which Boris Johnson has also called for, instead of us having to be under Germany's Federal Constitutional Court.

I'll be voting for out, unless things change drastically in our favour. It might cost us a fortune, but we will no doubt re-coup that over the years in saving the millions we pay for the privilege to be a part of it.

As he said, EU will take us to the 'enth degree before making real concessions or decisions as they did with Greece. We need to be guarded on the unfortunate double dealing and tricks that could come out of all this.

Last edited by granny; 3rd Feb 2016 9:31pm.

Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
~Chief Seattle
Re: Poll : The E.U. What do we want? [Re: palemoon] #1000064
3rd Feb 2016 10:21pm
3rd Feb 2016 10:21pm
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diggingdeeper Offline

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We already have a Supreme Court, although technically it is out-ranked by the European Court of Human Rights but this in word only - if a UK court and the ECHR have different rulings it is up to the UK government to choose how to resolve the case. The UK Government cannot overrule the ECHR's decision but it can ignore it.

The ECHR cannot overrule a UK court's decision.

A UK court cannot overrule a ECHR's decision.


In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. George Orwell

We should judge our economy by the absence of poverty, not the number of billionaires - Jeremy Corbyn
Re: Poll : The E.U. What do we want? [Re: diggingdeeper] #1000073
3rd Feb 2016 11:11pm
3rd Feb 2016 11:11pm
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granny Offline
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Yes, I think I meant to say that he would like there to be a Supreme Court in the UK., as the German Federal Constitutional Court.


Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
~Chief Seattle
Re: Poll : The E.U. What do we want? [Re: palemoon] #1000091
4th Feb 2016 4:32am
4th Feb 2016 4:32am
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diggingdeeper Offline

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What I think you meant to say is that BJ wants the UK Supreme Court to have the power to challenge EU law in the same way as the German Federal Constitution Court can.

However, the German federal Constitution Court was set up to challenge Germany's own laws independently of the rest of their legal system, I don't think its power over EU law has been tested as yet but presumably they can impose will on their Chancellor which is a more democratic solution than we have.


In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. George Orwell

We should judge our economy by the absence of poverty, not the number of billionaires - Jeremy Corbyn
Re: Poll : The E.U. What do we want? [Re: palemoon] #1000098
4th Feb 2016 10:31am
4th Feb 2016 10:31am
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Oxton
Gibbo Online content
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Another point of view to UKIP's broadcast:

http://www.theguardian.com/politics...ng-advert-denouncing-turkey-islamophobia

Quote
Ukip has been accused of “baseless scaremongering” after it used a party political broadcast on the BBC to warn of the dangers of Turkey joining the EU, highlighting its Muslim population and claiming 15 million of its citizens could migrate to the UK.

The advert provoked a backlash from pro-EU campaigners and MPs, as well as claims of Islamophobia from Twitter users, some of whom said they were planning to report the party to Ofcom.

Re: Poll : The E.U. What do we want? [Re: Gibbo] #1000103
4th Feb 2016 11:40am
4th Feb 2016 11:40am
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granny Offline
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Probably right. Turkey population has doubled in 40 yrs from
40 million to 80 million. Turkey is huge a concern, and always has been. They will run in this direction if given the opportunity. These people are fed up living in their own countries in squalor, and who can blame them ? They don't even need the money for their air fare anymore, they can walk from there.

Why does everyone jump on the Islamophobia band waggon ? We could start shouting that Islam is anti-semitic and anti Christian .....stupid people.

Europe, as it was intended is actually finished in my opinion and only those with significant interest such as businesses or EU jobs will be wanting to remain.

@DD. Yep, I think you might have got it there. That's what he was saying.

Last edited by granny; 4th Feb 2016 11:45am.

Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
~Chief Seattle
Re: Poll : The E.U. What do we want? [Re: palemoon] #1000105
4th Feb 2016 12:19pm
4th Feb 2016 12:19pm
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The trouble is that they don't want to stay amongst their own squalour but come out of it and bring all their medieval baggage with them and believe me they won't be satisfied until we all toe their line. You've only got to watch the programmes in which they appear, have a good old moan and then say that we should change our ways to accommodate their world view. Last Sunday's "The Big Question" is a good example of what I'm on about, they couldn't agree amongst themselves about what they wanted. Had experience of Turks in West Berlin for 7 years, they're not all bad but those who are more than make up for those who aren't. I even ended up in court because of one of the lying gits. Cleared by the way and in true German fashion he got done instead for telling porkies. Believe me, there may be trouble ahead. (As an adjoiner, the Turkish Cypriots were brilliant, no chip on their shoulders with the Brits.)


Birkenhead........ God's own Room 101.
Re: Poll : The E.U. What do we want? [Re: Gibbo] #1000106
4th Feb 2016 12:23pm
4th Feb 2016 12:23pm
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diggingdeeper Offline

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Originally Posted by Gibbo
Another point of view to UKIP's broadcast:

http://www.theguardian.com/politics...ng-advert-denouncing-turkey-islamophobia

Quote
Ukip has been accused of “baseless scaremongering” after it used a party political broadcast on the BBC to warn of the dangers of Turkey joining the EU, highlighting its Muslim population and claiming 15 million of its citizens could migrate to the UK.

The advert provoked a backlash from pro-EU campaigners and MPs, as well as claims of Islamophobia from Twitter users, some of whom said they were planning to report the party to Ofcom.


That is not what the UKIP broadcast said, it said 15 million could leave for Europe not the UK. Why are newspapers allowed to get away with drivel reporting like that! It is just plain irrefutable lies.


In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. George Orwell

We should judge our economy by the absence of poverty, not the number of billionaires - Jeremy Corbyn
Re: Poll : The E.U. What do we want? [Re: palemoon] #1000114
4th Feb 2016 2:53pm
4th Feb 2016 2:53pm
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I lean towards 'out' most of the time based on what Ive heard so far, but its hard to call , with all the flipping lies that are being trotted out and not a lot of reliable information .
I feel sure that after a bit of Brexit sorting time, economically and securitywise , we would manage fine but my main worry would be that I believe our exit would upset , seriously irritate, and alienate many countries (including America) big time and I fully imagine that whereas on a level playing field, we would have survived Brexit well, we may instead be looking at spiteful sabotage, plotting ,exclusion techniques and general revenge behaviour by the members of other governments, which if carried out in 'gang' mode , could seriously prevent us getting ahead economically. Although we are an island, and should be able to defend ourselves better than some, I can imagine that the remaining EU countries wouldnt lift a finger to help if we got into difficulties securitywise/invasionwise . Look at Ireland during the war, its said they deliberately left lights on to guide the bombers to the uk.


Re: Poll : The E.U. What do we want? [Re: palemoon] #1000134
4th Feb 2016 6:25pm
4th Feb 2016 6:25pm
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granny Offline
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I imagine the huge percentage would wish to end up in the UK. English is their second language as is the same with most countries. Not only that, for decades, all these countries had a dream of getting to UK, why do you think they all declared undying love for any English woman ? A means to an end. Same in the Arab countries, some of them have wives all over the world. Australia, UK, France... Very convenient!


Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves. All things are bound together. All things connect.
~Chief Seattle
Re: Poll : The E.U. What do we want? [Re: venice] #1000159
4th Feb 2016 8:45pm
4th Feb 2016 8:45pm
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Originally Posted by venice
Look at Ireland during the war, its said they deliberately left lights on to guide the bombers to the uk.


You need to read the Cranborne Report, while Ireland was officially neutral, they assisted the allies on the largest scale possible while keeping the facade of neutrality. 50,000 Irish people joined the UK armed forces voluntarily.

Ireland risked the wrath of America by remaining officially neutral, the UK even tried to bribe the Irish government by offering them Northern Ireland if they dropped their neutrality and joined the allies. Overall it didn't do Ireland any harm, the Americans seemed to forgive them overnight as I am sure they would us if we left the EU.

America are a bit scared of the EU developing into a super-power, if the UK broke up the EU we may even be treated as heroes once the dust settled.


In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. George Orwell

We should judge our economy by the absence of poverty, not the number of billionaires - Jeremy Corbyn
Re: Poll : The E.U. What do we want? [Re: palemoon] #1000221
5th Feb 2016 9:37am
5th Feb 2016 9:37am
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palemoon Offline OP
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Weird this. Last night I was telling some guys at my snooker club that I had started this poll and just out of interest we decided to take a poll in the club. The result were exactly the same as the results, so far, here. If this is an indication of the public's feelings it does make you wonder where the 'Stay' votes will come from.

Last edited by palemoon; 5th Feb 2016 9:38am.
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