Motorists with points won't be penalised with higher insurance premiums

An insurance company is no longer automatically penalising motorists with points on their licence due
to the rise in the number of speed camera convictions, it has been revealed.

The Swinton insurance company said insurance providers were "having to accept that points alone
can no longer be used as a yardstick for driver evaluation".

And the company added that drivers with six points or more on their licence could soon be viewed by
insurance companies as "standard" rather than "non-standard" drivers.

Motorists who incur 12 penalty points over a period of three years are liable to be disqualified.

The anti-speed camera group Safe Speed said the Swinton move showed that cameras were damaging the penalty points system.

Swinton said that with 6,000 speed cameras on the road catching two million speeders every year and drivers using hand-held mobile phones now incurring three-point penalties, "an unblemished licence is becoming rare".

Neil Ackinclose of Swinton added: "Over the last few years we have seen a dramatic increase in the number of drivers with penalty points requesting insurance.

"A few years ago insurers might have assumed that a motorist with six or more points on their license was a reckless driver, but that is no longer necessarily the case.

"A 2006 YouGov survey estimated that 16 per cent of drivers now have points on their licence.

"As that figure continues to grow - with some estimating the actual number of drivers with points to be in the region of 10 million - insurance providers are having to accept that points alone can no longer be used as a yardstick for driver evaluation."

Safe Speed founder Paul Smith said: "Insurance companies are in the business of calculating risk to set their premiums.

"This announcement is all the proof we need to know that driving licence points no longer indicate risky drivers.

"The vast majority of licence points are for speeding offences detected by camera.

"The Department for Transport's needless and ineffective obsession with speed cameras has therefore seriously damaged the penalty points system."

An excellent move.

There are very few people I know with a full clean licence, even the best drivers.

Perhaps it might be worth getting a quote?

yeh it is a good move. will b gettin a quote when my insureince is up

An excellent move Joe??

Firstly, its something that has been done for ages by many insurance companies, its just the first time a company has made it actual policy.

Secondly, its a VERY bad move as it now encourages drivers to speed and drive dangerously, as they will soon feel that they can get upto 6 points and it wont even affect them.

And thirdly, why should we all pay the same price (I, and many people I know dont have points) for insurance, when its people who speed and drive dangerously and end up having accidents that make insurance costs so high.

I strongly disagree with them making insurance costs the same even for drivers with 6 points, they have got these points through dangerous driving one way or another, speed IS dangerous driving.

I personally believe this is more a marketing scam, which ultimately will lead to mass abuse of the current safe driving laws, as people will begin to see points as near-meaningless.

Simple why should you be fined twice ?

1. The Ticket.
2. Your insurance.

Well done swinton for making a stand.
If i had points for speeding i would be calling them

Point discussed on Northwest Tonight by swinton insurance,

Points do not show if your a careless / dangerous driver.
Convictions do that.

Wow I cant believe you are all agreeing with it, without considering the consequences of speeding. Twice in the last 2 years I have been doing ~30mph in built up area's and kids have run out into the road from behind park cars (once in Leasowe, once in the North End), and had I been doing 35mph, I would have hit them for sure.

35mph may not seem like speeding in a 30mph limit, even 40mph may not, but it DOES cause accidents, and DOES cause fatalities in some unfortunate situations.

In that case then, lets fook the speed laws you are basically saying, lets just drive at whatever speeds we want to, as just becuase someone got 3 points for doing 41mph in a 30mph limit, they were still driving as safe as possible and at no increased risk of having an accident.

Jeeze do you think the speed limits on non-motorway/dual carriageway routes are put in place to piss drivers off? They are there to help prevent accidents, and to help prevent fatalaties as a result of accidents. As a driver, we forget how vulnerable pedestrians can be.

If one of your family was hit by a driver doing 35mph in a 30mph limit zone, and ended up injured as a result, maybe even seriously, and it was found that had he travelling at less then 32mph in all likelyhood the accident wouldnt have happened, you would soon change your mind and realise that insurance companies charging higher premiums for points DOES deter drivers from speeding/driving dangerously. And you would be calling for them to be prosecuted. Yet its fine in your view at the moment, and its not dangerous driving to be doing so...

exactly.

Yes, an excellent move.

My insurance is extremely high as is with all newer drivers (i.e. less than 2 years) The only way for me to get lower insurance atm is to move to a better area (not likely), give up driving (which I have done temporarily just to save money from insurance), lie about my endorsements (which I don't want to do as it will invalidate my insurance) or build up my no claims - which I can't actually do as I can hardly afford insurance in the first place!

In no way will it encourage dangerous driving - why would it? "Oh, it's ok, I'll just drive round like an idiot because my insurance is low"

Don't forget, the 6 points within your first 2 years and you're back to a learner still applies.

Okay so it seems the people in this thread agree with and condone speeding... fair enough, but I just hope to god none of you dont have a member of your family or a friend hit and injured as a result of a speeding driver.

an if u do end up getting 6 points in the 1st 2 years u have 2 do the 2 years over again

I dont agree with or condone speeding.

Its not all about speeding - what about parking offences, or that section 59 act?

The reason its come in is because of the high amount of drivers getting fixed penalties for speeding.

Fixed penalty notices are only issued 99% of the time if you do wrong. Very few are issued for reasons other then actual driving offences. Not indicating IS dangerous. Parking on double yellows CAN be dangerous to other drivers and pedestrians. Speeding IS dangerous. Full stop.

And by agreeing that drivers should not be penalised on their insurance for things like speeding, you are condoning speeding and the insurance companies are removing one of the deterrents for people not to want to speed.

Speed camera's are the deterrents for speeding.
Coppers in a car.
A van on a hill.

Not that your insurance is going to be higher.



Its not the insurance companies responsibility to enforce speeding laws or fines.

I Hope this starts a trend amongst other insurance groups.

I give up, people seem to agree that speeding should not be punished and the people who dont speed (or at least get caught doing so) should pay the same price as the ones who do speed and yet are less likely to have an accident. Speeding is dangerous driving at the end of the day.

The only real deterrent for speeding to most people is the fact that insurance premiums rise more then anything, especially drivers under the age of 24, when this is removed, people wont be so worried.

Either way, its just a marketing scam by Swinton imho, they have been in decline for years.

it isnt a deterrent though, its a punishment afterwards, ontop of a fine, points, ban, or revert back to a learner.

As your a man of your business-voted ways, I'll put it another way - it also affects businesses too.
If one of their drivers has points from an incident outside of work, their insurance increases so not only is it the individual that is affected.

Same goes with young drivers trying to afford a better way of getting around on their parents policies - insurance prices increase for them too, and they might not even have any points themselves.

It is a deterrent, I know for a fact that I dont want to be getting myself points for speeding as there is a chance it could increase my insurance.

Many people think of it this way, if the insurance isnt going to increase, they will "more likely" to speed as they will be less worried about their insurance going up if they are caught.

Basically, everyones insurance is probably going to go up overall as a result of this, as drivers who are getting stung for having points for speeding wont be if the rest of the industry follow. Why should I pay the same price as people who have points for dangerous driving (again, speeding is dangerous driving).

I see your point, but I don't think having a hike in your insurance for up to 3 years (i think, is it?) until it comes off your licence for a simple mistake such as driving too fast in an area you are unfamiliar with and then caught out by a camera or accidently speeding (we've all done it).

If it we're on purpose, then the points should play a role in insurance prices, perhaps if you we're caught by a traffic cop, through additional speeding codes to say you were doing it delibrately and it wasn't your misjudgement of the speed limit instead?

Lol misjudgement of the speed limits cant really be argued, as its your responsibility to know what the speed limits are. Its not that difficult to be honest.

Having a la like that would make it even worse, as the cop would then have to prove you were speeding intentionally lol, whereas the defendent would always say it was because they didnt realise what the limit was. Would actually be a really funny catch 22.

Matty i'm sure you have speeded but not been caught?
Everyone is Human.

Like i say its not the responsibility of the insurance company's to enforce fines or increased premiums.

Its been proven that its convictions prove a dangerous driver
not a speed camera.

+ 5mph does not necessarily make you a dangerous driver.

5mph+ can be the difference between an accident and a near miss though. Its been the difference for me twice, it will be the deciding factor for people in the future and it wont always go the right way.

Yes it does work both ways.

It doesnt really help you condoning and encouraging speeding Mark. This is a public forum and a serious topic. Its not sending out the right message.

[youtube]NuJKAuSocbA[/youtube]

My video shows that being +5 can save lives,
where as yours shows +5 can kill?

Both examples of what can happen!

Just to bring your comments into context above matty
have you ever speeded?

Erm the one you posted is a pisstake, and very unlikely to happen. And yes I have speeded, but most of the time I try not to. Im certainly not a regular speeder and have no intention of becoming one. I dont get intimidated by drivers who try to push me to go faster either.

And boy am I glad im not a regular/casual speeder, as I say, there has been two incidents in the past two years where I would have hit kids had I have been.

I know quite a few people though who would speed everywhere if it were not for the worry about points going against them on their insurance premiums.

Speeding is Speeding !

And your lucky you didn't get a ticket or caught.

Swinton Insurance are the first Insurance company to recognise that we are human.
Mistakes can be made, as joe says in unfamiliar area's etc..

As Jim Davidson said on one of his shows,
how can he be done for speeding 3 times on the same road?
He never slowed down.

Dont forget all the faulty speed cameras where joe public have been done !

Its been long said that if insurance was cheaper more people would have it.

There was a time when you couldn't hire a car unless your licence was clean, but now they will accept 3 points as its assumed its for speeding.

Times are changing and companies change policys to match.
Lets see who follows?

here here!