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#997737 - 10th Jan 2016 2:26pm EU Referendum
granny Offline

Wiki Master

Registered: 29th Jun 2011
Posts: 13848
Loc: Wirral
Four main aims for renegotiation.

1 Economic governance: Securing an explicit recognition that the euro is not the only currency of the European Union, to ensure countries outside the eurozone are not disadvantaged. The UK wants safeguards that it will not have to contribute to eurozone bailouts

2 Competitiveness: Setting a target for the reduction of the "burden" of excessive regulation and extending the single market

3 Immigration: Restricting access to in-work and out-of-work benefits to EU migrants. Specifically, ministers want to stop those coming to the UK from claiming certain benefits until they have been resident for four years.

4 Sovereignty: Allowing Britain to opt out from further political integration. Giving greater powers to national parliaments to block EU legislation



To me, that doesn't go near enough to spelling out what it actually means and how we would benefit in the long term. These things can always be changed and developed upon again, as has happened over the years with the so called 'Common Market'.
Is that why Maggie kept banging on about buying British, to prevent the foreign firms from moving in and taking our British companies from under our noses ?

As someone said, if we stay in we really don't know where we are all heading, and it's the unknown which is the worrying factor. Particularly when it is being run by dictatorial methods, which will only increase as the years go by.


Interestingly, Mrs Merkel is now looking at changing the policy of deporting migrants back to their homeland, after the happenings of Cologne. Funny how changes can be made when wanted rather than needed ! Just goes to prove nothing is set in concrete in Europe, just depends on the mood of the moment, who it affects and then we all get dragged in the same direction for better for worse, for richer or poorer,in sickness and in health, until death us do part !

Any thoughts ?


Edited by granny (10th Jan 2016 2:28pm)
_________________________
...and those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music.FN

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#997738 - 10th Jan 2016 3:20pm Re: EU Referendum [Re: granny]
chriskay Offline
Forum Veteran

Registered: 25th Oct 2007
Posts: 4868
Loc: shropshire
I, having been a strong supporter of our membership, have changed my mind and will vote to leave.
I do not intend to enter into any discussion here as to why.
_________________________
Carpe diem.

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#997740 - 10th Jan 2016 4:09pm Re: EU Referendum [Re: granny]
diggingdeeper Offline

Wiki Guardian

Registered: 9th Jul 2008
Posts: 9767
Loc: Birkenhead
Originally Posted By: granny
Interestingly, Mrs Merkel is now looking at changing the policy of deporting migrants back to their homeland, after the happenings of Cologne. Funny how changes can be made when wanted rather than needed ! Just goes to prove nothing is set in concrete in Europe, just depends on the mood of the moment, who it affects and then we all get dragged in the same direction for better for worse, for richer or poorer,in sickness and in health, until death us do part !


Just goes to show how much Germany is controlling (has taken over) Europe.

Don't forget that the Deutsch Mark has not been officially obliterated unlike most of the other European currencies. In 2011/12 they were even re-printing the Deutsch Mark.
_________________________
In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. George Orwell

When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. Socrates

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#997755 - 10th Jan 2016 7:05pm Re: EU Referendum [Re: granny]
casper Online   content
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Registered: 13th May 2012
Posts: 1254
Loc: wallasey
Cameron has already got his deal, 3 out of the four no change on immigration he has had it since day one, he will announce those findings in due course, and laud it as a great victory for GB due to the success of all his campaining,I despair we are giving legal aid to illegals to fight deportation,British legal firms are taking actions against our armed forces, you couldnt make it up, and they wonder why they cant find enough recruits, we do have an enemy within, but its not the Trade Unions, nor the average British worker,

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#997757 - 10th Jan 2016 7:47pm Re: EU Referendum [Re: granny]
dizdazdoz Offline

Wise One

Registered: 17th Jan 2010
Posts: 872
Loc: Here
Our whole GOVT to me seems corrupt, I don't see how staying in benefits the "man on the street". What worries me is they will use scare tactics so those who don't look enough in to the situation will vote how they feel is safe which is naturally "Better the devil you know"

Hard to believe the Germans lost both World Wars, 71 years later and they are in prime position politically to rule Europe anyway. Crazy crazy world we live in.

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#997768 - 10th Jan 2016 11:35pm Re: EU Referendum [Re: granny]
granny Offline

Wiki Master

Registered: 29th Jun 2011
Posts: 13848
Loc: Wirral
There are many in the Government who will not be voting for staying in the EU. John Redwood being one of them. So what do they know, that we don't ?

_________________________
...and those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music.FN

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#997769 - 10th Jan 2016 11:53pm Re: EU Referendum [Re: chriskay]
snowhite Offline

Wiki Guide

Registered: 31st Jan 2014
Posts: 5648
Loc: Wirral
Originally Posted By: chriskay
I, having been a strong supporter of our membership, have changed my mind and will vote to leave.
I do not intend to enter into any discussion here as to why.
same here ,i do not want to say why.

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#997771 - 11th Jan 2016 1:01am Re: EU Referendum [Re: granny]
RUDEBOX Offline

Wiki Master

Registered: 29th Aug 2008
Posts: 19082
Loc: Bob Land
Will vote to Stay In. Not saying why raftl
_________________________
Mia Mabel


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#997792 - 11th Jan 2016 10:22am Re: EU Referendum [Re: granny]
derekdwc Online   content


Forum Veteran

Registered: 13th Oct 2008
Posts: 4973
Loc: Birkenhead
Not given enough facts and figures to have an informed opinion myself.
Where are the TV debates etc

If we come out, would it give gov enough powers (having a majority it has) to drasticly trample over workers rights and further their agendas?)

I can foresee the PM coming back waving a piece of paper telling us how well he's done in his negotiations.

eg

The phrase "peace for our time" was spoken on 30 September 1938 by British Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain in his speech concerning the Munich Agreement and the Anglo-German Declaration.

The phrase echoed Benjamin Disraeli, who upon returning from the Congress of Berlin in 1878 stated "I have returned from Germany with peace for our time.


Edited by derekdwc (11th Jan 2016 10:27am)

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#997818 - 11th Jan 2016 2:35pm Re: EU Referendum [Re: chriskay]
jimbob Offline

Forum Addict

Registered: 26th Nov 2008
Posts: 1537
Loc: Birkenhead
I also will be voting to leave
_________________________
Ships that pass in the night, seldom seen and soon forgoten

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#997825 - 11th Jan 2016 3:37pm Re: EU Referendum [Re: granny]
dustymclean Offline

Old Hand

Registered: 18th Sep 2013
Posts: 314
Loc: birkenhead
I am going to ask my Grandson what he would do if he were able to vote.This is about their future,people knocking on heavens door should do the same.When you look at our Monarchy, currency, closed borders and the big money laundrette in London, we have never really been in the EU.Lower the voting age to sixteen and no vote for people over whatever is the retirement age at the time of the referendum.The future belongs to them.

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#997851 - 11th Jan 2016 6:32pm Re: EU Referendum [Re: granny]
diggingdeeper Offline

Wiki Guardian

Registered: 9th Jul 2008
Posts: 9767
Loc: Birkenhead
I can see Cameron getting just enough changes to top the balance even though it will be far from perfect.

Losing the veto would be a big step in our control of Europe. I can see me voting to stay in even though I'm strongly against the EEC - keep your friends close and your enemies closer!

We need to have clearer rules in this country what powers the government have without calling a referendum, its pathetic that we had a referendum for the common market which was quite a minor thing compared to the powers we have transferred to Europe since.
_________________________
In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. George Orwell

When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. Socrates

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#997862 - 11th Jan 2016 7:05pm Re: EU Referendum [Re: granny]
cools Offline
Forum Addict

Registered: 16th Aug 2013
Posts: 1583
Loc: Wirral
Out for me..

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#997864 - 11th Jan 2016 7:39pm Re: EU Referendum [Re: derekdwc]
doglover4 Offline
Newbeee

Registered: 19th Dec 2014
Posts: 12
Loc: wallasey
if we come out then no Government now, or in the future' will be able to hide behind EU rules and will answer to us, the voters, instead

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#997865 - 11th Jan 2016 7:41pm Re: EU Referendum [Re: dustymclean]
doglover4 Offline
Newbeee

Registered: 19th Dec 2014
Posts: 12
Loc: wallasey
really, most of them can't tie their own shoelaces let alone the idea of voting

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