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#226061 - 8th May 2008 6:49pm Turbo Technical Help
BMW Joe Offline
Wiki Master

Registered: 30th Apr 2006
Posts: 12369
Loc: Birkenhead
I've never owned a turbo, I know how turbos work, but I don't have an experience with how they physically operate or the set up of them.

So anyway, I spotted this on eBay the other day, and was thinking about whether this would work with mine.


eBay Link



Originally Posted By:
Brand new, one off custom turbo manifold to fit BMW E36
318i. The flange's are designed to take any of the garrett GT
series turbo's. The heat wrap is in place to protect the spark
plug wires, coming out from the power pack. The rest of the
manifold has been heat wrapped to ensure, minimal heat soak into
other engine components, and also to ensure maximum gas flow
velocity. This manifold replaces the existing one, and the
Y-Pipe. You will need to take your car to an exhaust centre so
they can cut your exhaust just before the lambada sensor (on the
engine side), and then flare the pipe so the downpipe slides in
and clamps down. As shown in the picture. It is a very easy job
and should cost no more than £30. Or if you are fairly apt at
such things, you can do it yourself. The entire manifold and
downpipe is made of stainless steel, it is tubular for better
flow, it has also been heat treated against cracking. I have also
wrapped it in heat insulating tape. There is also a lambada
sensor bung in place.

The manifold is designed to be a top mount the turbo. This makes
its far more easy to get a good oil drain and positioning of
compressor outlet piping. It also makes a straighter and far more
efficiant flow of gas for the downpipe. Plus it looks great to
open the bonnet and see a turbo!!! The only two things that have
to be moved in the engine bay in order to fit this and a turbo
are:

* The windscreen washer fluid bottle. It has to be moved to
make room for the turbo. A very easy thing to do, can be replaced
by a sports edition bag, or any plastic bottle.
* The top radiator hose. It has to be moved in order for the
compressor outlet (boost) pipe to go down into the intercooler,
or straight to the inlet manifold (whatever you decide.) Samco
sell a replacement radiator hose that can be manipulated to get
round this.

The manifold works with the M43 type engine. However it may work,
with the M42 and M44 type engines. I'm not entirely sure.

The testing alone cost many hundreds of pounds to make sure it
works, let alone the actual build. It is designed to be for the
serious tuner/customiser. This is not a "turbo manifold" that you
buy on E-Bay and have to hack your engine bay to get it to fit.
IT WILL FIT STRAIGHT ON, NO FURTHER MODIFICATIONS ARE NEEDED FOR
THE E36 M43 engine.. To whoever purchases the manifold, i will be
more than happy to answer any questions you may have to help
build your turbo BMW.



I probably won't buy it, but I'm just after technical information and advice.

It has been designed for use on an M43 engine, the sucessor to the engine in mine, the M40.

AFAIK, the only major difference between the two is the inlet manifold design the rest is just improvements.

Mine is a 316i and the manifold is designed for a 318i. Apart from the obvious differences (port sizes e.t.c) and assuming it fitted, would this work on my engine?

I'm assuming I would have to uprate the bottom end of the engine (rods? pistons? e.t.c)

How much would the right turbo cost?

How would I provide an oil feed? Direct to the turbo?

Adding an intercooler means I can have more boost?


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#226068 - 8th May 2008 7:26pm Re: Turbo Technical Help [Re: BMW Joe]
MrPhil Offline
Forum Master

Registered: 14th Apr 2006
Posts: 2367
Loc: Prenton
You might be lucky and find that the ports are the same on both heads. The right turbo will be down to what power you would like to go for, for instance some turbo kits don't need the std engine modifying due to it being a low pressure turbo. I'd get on a Bmw forum and see who has done the conversion.
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#226069 - 8th May 2008 7:29pm Re: Turbo Technical Help [Re: BMW Joe]
_Ste_ Offline


Wiki Master

Registered: 7th Aug 2005
Posts: 15986
Loc: New Brighton
Cool mod joe, your car has a top speed of 120 mph, i know because i`ve done it in a 316i, although this is a cool mod its also quite expensive, personaly i`d just uprate the cams etc as you`d get more for your money and it won`t kill you on insuranse as the turbo would wink

Just my thoughts, good luck smile
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#226071 - 8th May 2008 7:39pm Re: Turbo Technical Help [Re: _Ste_]
BMW Joe Offline
Wiki Master

Registered: 30th Apr 2006
Posts: 12369
Loc: Birkenhead
I have fast road cams mate and it seems they haven't made the slightest bit of difference (don't know about figures though)

Regardless of cost, this car is a project car and always will be, I'm using this one to learn from (hopefully, not by mistakes) so the more I do, and the more I learn, the better smile

never thought about the insurance though.
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#226073 - 8th May 2008 8:37pm Re: Turbo Technical Help [Re: BMW Joe]
StuyMac Offline

Wiki Master

Registered: 24th Nov 2003
Posts: 12002
Loc: Wirralshire
The turbo is just the start matey frown

Its easy to bolt a turbo to any car with the right manifold to fit it, the problem, and hard part os matching the fueling....

With a turbo, you cram more air in to the cylinder, this in turn needs more fuel. Heat is also generated by a turbo, again this needs more fuel.

In addition to the turbo, ideally you need a bigger AFM to measure more air, bigger injectors to supply more fuel, and something ECU wise to control it all smile
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#226080 - 8th May 2008 9:00pm Re: Turbo Technical Help [Re: StuyMac]
BMW Joe Offline
Wiki Master

Registered: 30th Apr 2006
Posts: 12369
Loc: Birkenhead
so could the standard ECU be altered enough or would a replacement ECU be necessary?

I've had a quick look on bimmer forums and the likes and nearly every reply suggested replacing the engine for a bigger (and then add a turbo to that if you still wanted more power)

They said even if the cost of the turbo kit is cheap, it's getting the set up right.
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#226144 - 9th May 2008 8:43am Re: Turbo Technical Help [Re: BMW Joe]
StuyMac Offline

Wiki Master

Registered: 24th Nov 2003
Posts: 12002
Loc: Wirralshire
You can modify the std ECU, but it will need a socket soldering in, and then a custom chip fitting and mapping.

Like the beemer guys, Id fit a bigger motor first...
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#226155 - 9th May 2008 10:14am Re: Turbo Technical Help [Re: StuyMac]
BMW Joe Offline
Wiki Master

Registered: 30th Apr 2006
Posts: 12369
Loc: Birkenhead
Nice one Stuy.

Just them other questions if you can answer them..?

bottom end need uprating?

How much would the right turbo cost?

how do you provide an oil feed? Direct to the turbo?

Adding an intercooler means more boost?
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#226156 - 9th May 2008 10:26am Re: Turbo Technical Help [Re: BMW Joe]
StuyMac Offline

Wiki Master

Registered: 24th Nov 2003
Posts: 12002
Loc: Wirralshire
Quote:

bottom end need uprating?


Depends how much boost you want to run... Turbo pistons are harder than N/A Pistons, and can take more heat and pressure. Rods are stronger, as are cranks. Manufactors that do engine with a N/A and Turbo variant, although the parts inside look the same, they are not - eg the SR20DE Nissan Engine, and the Turbod SR20DET are basically the same, but the "T" has a stronger crank, rods, pistons, thicker liners and oil squirters pionting at the pistons the keep them cooler.

Quote:
How much would the right turbo cost?


Depends what you want to fit. A std T25 can cost £50, the turbo on my Nissan cost £700....

Quote:
how do you provide an oil feed? Direct to the turbo?


Yeah, take a pressurised oil feed and run it in to the top of the turbo, the drain is then generally tapped in to the sump.

Quote:
Adding an intercooler means more boost?


No, an intercooler cools the charge temp. Charge temps tend to get higher with more boost, though even at std, the cooler the charge temp the better.
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#254076 - 1st Sep 2008 10:28am Re: Turbo Technical Help [Re: StuyMac]
chris bmw M3 Offline
Smartchild

Registered: 8th Mar 2005
Posts: 410
Loc: Bidston
Standard bottom end on nearly all BMs is up to the job;)(up to 10-12psi anyway) However,as stuy said its all the other bits you need that put the price of conversions up...

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#254077 - 1st Sep 2008 10:41am Re: Turbo Technical Help [Re: chris bmw M3]
chris bmw M3 Offline
Smartchild

Registered: 8th Mar 2005
Posts: 410
Loc: Bidston
For all the work you would put in (and money)I would just convert to s52 engine and running gear(M3 e36) Either 3.0 or 3.2 will transform the performance overnight and is not actually that hard to do...you need a full damaged car(seen one for £2000)to do it. I would help with this cos it would be sweet... happy

And if your not happy with performance in the future you can bolt a turbo onto them as well(not cheap)to give a MINIMUM of 580 bhp!!


Edited by chris bmw M3 (1st Sep 2008 10:42am)

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#254119 - 1st Sep 2008 5:30pm Re: Turbo Technical Help [Re: chris bmw M3]
BMW Joe Offline
Wiki Master

Registered: 30th Apr 2006
Posts: 12369
Loc: Birkenhead
Cheers Chris.

Don't plan on doing any conversions yet - still paying £200 a month insurance for a 1.6 omg
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#254121 - 1st Sep 2008 5:42pm Re: Turbo Technical Help [Re: chris bmw M3]
DavidB Offline
Wiki Guide

Registered: 7th Dec 2003
Posts: 5595
Loc: Bebington, Wirral
You'd gain more power and it'd probably work out cheaper (and easier) to put a bigger engine in. I always hear people asking on forums how to make their 1.4/1.6 more powerful and the answer is to put a bigger engine in. wink
BMW like Honda have had decades of making good NA engines. wink
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#254124 - 1st Sep 2008 5:47pm Re: Turbo Technical Help [Re: DavidB]
BMW Joe Offline
Wiki Master

Registered: 30th Apr 2006
Posts: 12369
Loc: Birkenhead
Originally Posted By: Station
the answer is to put a bigger engine in

Yeah thats the answer I found on a lot of other forums too
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#254259 - 1st Sep 2008 9:57pm Re: Turbo Technical Help [Re: BMW Joe]
jason24v6
Unregistered


Originally Posted By: BMW Joe

Don't plan on doing any conversions yet - still paying £200 a month insurance for a 1.6 omg



fookin ell omg thats bad snob

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