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#14783 - 20th Oct 2004 3:03pm Liverpool to vote on smoking ban
Tony MK2 Offline
Forum Master

Registered: 2nd Dec 2003
Posts: 2943
Loc: Wirral


Bars, restaurants and offices could be targeted by the ban


Liverpool could become the first city in the UK to ban smoking in public places, if a bill before the city's council is adopted later.
The ban would make it illegal to smoke in restaurants, pubs, shops, offices and other enclosed workplaces.

If councillors approve the bill, they would then petition Parliament for a smoke-free law for Liverpool.

The council says it would impose a fine of 1,000 on anyone breaching the law, which it wants passed within a year.

Councillor Richard Oglethorpe, the city council's executive member of green issues, said more than 1,000 people died of illnesses related to passive smoking each year in Liverpool.

"Liverpool is the lung cancer capital of the United Kingdom. It's not a title we're proud of, it's one we want to get rid of," he said.

Introducing the smoking ban will help people give up

Cllr Richard Oglethorpe
He said a ban was supported by smokers and non-smokers alike.

"Most smokers want to give up and the place where they find it hardest to give up is when you go into a bar, you've had a few drinks, everyone else is smoking so people tend to go back to their old ways.

"Introducing the smoking ban will help people give up."

He rejected claims that a ban, like that now in force in Ireland, was part of a "nanny state" mentality, insisting the aim was to protect the health of vulnerable workers.

He said he was "quietly confident" that a majority of Liberal Democrat and Labour councillors would support the bill when it was considered by the council.

If it is approved, a petition would have to reach Parliament by 27 November to be considered in the next legislative session.

An official report by medical scientists, which emerged on Monday, found that breathing in secondhand smoke massively increased the risk of lung cancer and heart disease.

Campaigners said the report strengthened the case for a nationwide ban on smoking in public places.

But a pro-smoking lobby group argued that the case against passive smoking has never been properly proven.

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#14784 - 20th Oct 2004 3:09pm Re: Liverpool to vote on smoking ban
learner Offline
Forum Addict

Registered: 4th Oct 2004
Posts: 1464
Loc: pensby
i cant really give my view cuz i dont smoke.

but to tell the thruth i really dont like the smell, but like wether spoons they sud spilt it up a non-smoking bar and a smoking bar.

but then at least ppl have got the choose to go where they want
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#14785 - 20th Oct 2004 3:31pm Re: Liverpool to vote on smoking ban
AX_125 Offline

Forum Guardian

Registered: 10th Nov 2003
Posts: 3791
Loc: Home
Ban smoking everywhere.

It is a horrible smell and makes me and probably every non-smoker uncomfortable and unhealthy.

I am sure if chronic farting was a choice and addictive it would be made an offence really quickly so why should smoking be tolerated?
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#14786 - 20th Oct 2004 4:08pm Re: Liverpool to vote on smoking ban
Rocco Offline
Veteran

Registered: 7th Jun 2004
Posts: 738
Loc: Neston, South Wirral
Quote:
Ban smoking everywhere
Yeah that should be up there at the top of the list with Murder think
There is more things in life to worry about than the issue of passive smoking that by anyones standards causes minimal risk, i still agree however that smoking should not be exposed to younger children as it can cause all sorts of damage to their development
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#14787 - 20th Oct 2004 6:09pm Re: Liverpool to vote on smoking ban
Mark Offline


Wiki Master

Registered: 9th Nov 2003
Posts: 20958
Loc: Wirral
I live on the Wirral laugh

Its a good thing and in years to come,
it will be wiped out i'm sure...

Its difficult to stop,
but everything helps....

Buy the time it goes underground, i wont be around frown cough, cough, cough...

Just wish i never started sorry
But its difficult when your mates wont give you a
bucket and spade in the sand pit, if you dont have one with them.
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#14788 - 20th Oct 2004 6:55pm Re: Liverpool to vote on smoking ban
Tony MK2 Offline
Forum Master

Registered: 2nd Dec 2003
Posts: 2943
Loc: Wirral
I use to be a smoker but i packed in about 8 or 9 years ago now i was smoking a hell of a lot i was like chain smoking one after the other and one day i said to the misses thats it am jibin it cause i was spendin to much money on the fags so i quit and bought a car instead lol

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#14789 - 20th Oct 2004 7:26pm Re: Liverpool to vote on smoking ban
Anonymous
Unregistered


Hiya hi

Its never going to work! Nobody will be *****.
Thats like saying ban all non - smokers from bars, pubs etc. As if that would happen!

What is the world coming to?!?!

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#14790 - 20th Oct 2004 7:39pm Re: Liverpool to vote on smoking ban
tony_220 Offline
Forum Addict

Registered: 27th May 2004
Posts: 1225
Loc: wirral
ban smoking I say!!! its filthy!!!
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#14791 - 20th Oct 2004 8:45pm Re: Liverpool to vote on smoking ban
Foxy Offline
Newbeee

Registered: 1st Dec 2003
Posts: 10
Loc: Wirral ed'
i feel that smoking is being forced out, i must admit i don`t really like it, but people do it and will carry on smoking regardless

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#14792 - 20th Oct 2004 9:47pm Re: Liverpool to vote on smoking ban
Tony MK2 Offline
Forum Master

Registered: 2nd Dec 2003
Posts: 2943
Loc: Wirral
Majority back public smoking ban

Many people hate smoky bars

Almost three-quarters of people (73%) who responded to a BBC survey want a ban on smoking in all public places as a way to cut tobacco-related illness.
More than 9,000 people were polled for their views on public health issues.

There was also strong support (81%) for a ban on fast food and sweet adverts on television when children are watching.

Some 72% of respondents said crisps, chocolates and fizzy drinks machines should be banned from all school premises.

Two-thirds (65%) said that bottles of alcohol should carry a government health warning.

The full results of the survey will be presented to the Department of Health, which announced details of its own major consultation on public health earlier this month.

The BBC survey found a lower level of support for the idea of an additional tax on high fat foods - however, this was still favoured by 54% of respondents.

Sexual health

In the arena of sexual health 60% of those who took part in the consultation said that regular, mandatory screening for sexually transmitted infections should not be provided by the NHS for all adults over the age of 16.

However, a higher proportion of those aged 24 and under supported screening (53%) than those aged over 55 (43%).

Nearly two thirds of respondents (64%) said condoms should be freely available on demand to all secondary school pupils.

Again those aged 24 and under were more supportive (72%) than those aged 55 plus (39%).

Despite widespread support for action to combat issues such as smoking and obesity, there was little backing for the idea that people should be penalised for contributing to their own ill-health.

Just one third (33%) said that patients whose medical condition can be linked to smoking, drinking or obesity should be given a lower priority for treatment.

Action needed

Ian Willmore, of the anti-smoking charity Action on Smoking and Health, said: "This poll shows that the public is demanding action to end smoking in the workplace and enclosed public places.

"This is the single most effective thing the government could do to cut smoking rates and protect smokers and non-smokers alike.

"It is time for the government to recognise the overwhelming public demand for action."

Simon Clark, of the smokers' rights organisation Forest, said the findings of the poll contradicted those of other independent surveys.

"These show that the majority of people, while favouring restrictions on smoking, do not support a blanket ban," he said.

"Pubs, clubs and restaurants must be free to adopt a policy that they see best suits their business."

Neville Rigby, of the International Obesity Task Force, said: "We welcome the poll results which support the recommendations we have made to the government to take action along these lines.

"We recommended in submissions to the parliamentary sub-committee investigating obesity that exactly this should happen.

"There should be restrictions on the marketing to children through television and other media and there should be withdrawal of vending machines and other marketing to children in schools."


The results of the survey were discussed in a BBC One special, 'Your NHS: For Better or Worse' broadcast at 2100 GMT on Wednesday 24 March.
The consultation was not a scientific poll. People were asked to answer questions by phone or online. A total of 9,479 people responded.

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#14793 - 20th Oct 2004 9:48pm Re: Liverpool to vote on smoking ban
Tony MK2 Offline
Forum Master

Registered: 2nd Dec 2003
Posts: 2943
Loc: Wirral
Q&A: Passive smoking


Tobacco smoke contains many chemicals
Pressure is mounting for a total ban on smoking in public places.
An update to a major review by the Government-appointed Scientific Committee on Tobacco and Health (SCOTH) has highlighted the health risks associated with passive smoking.

The British Medical Association is among those who believe a ban would make a signficant contribution to public health.

However, opponents say it would be draconian and unnecesary.

BBC News Online examines the evidence.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

What is passive smoking?

Simply, breathing in other people's tobacco smoke. This is made up of "sidestream" smoke from the burning tip of the cigarette, and "mainstream" smoke that has been inhaled and then exhaled by the smoker.

Sidestream smoke accounts for nearly 85% of the smoke in a room.

What's in the smoke?

Tobacco smoke contains over 4000 chemicals in the form of particles and gases.

The particulate phase includes tar, nicotine, benzene and benzo(a)pyrene.

The gas phase includes carbon monoxide, ammonia, dimethylnitrosamine, formaldehyde, hydrogen cyanide and acrolein.

It has been estimated that tobacco smoke contains as many as 60 substances which cause - or are suspected of causing - cancer.

And many irritate the tissues of the respiratory system.

The Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) in the USA has classified environmental tobacco smoke as a class A carcinogen - ranking it alongside asbestos and arsenic.

What effect does it have on the passive smoker?

Breathing in other people's smoke can cause eye irritation, headache, cough, sore throat, dizziness and nausea. Just 30 minutes exposure can be enough to reduce blood flow through the heart.

There is also evidence to show that people with asthma can experience a significant decline in lung function when exposed.

Whether or not passive smoking can trigger new cases of asthma is a hotly debated issue.

What about in the longer term?

Non-smokers who are exposed to passive smoking in the home, have a 25% increased risk of heart disease and lung cancer.

Researchers from London's St George's Medical School and the Royal Free hospital have recently found when you include exposure to passive smoking in the workplace and public places the risk of coronary heart disease is increased by 50-60%.

A major review in 1998 by the Government-appointed Scientific Committee on Tobacco and Health (SCOTH) concluded that passive smoking is a cause of lung cancer and ischaemic heart disease in adult non-smokers, and a cause of respiratory disease, cot death, middle ear disease and asthmatic attacks in children.

There is also some evidence to suggest that passive smoking may affect children's mental development.

SCOTH has looked at the data since 1998 and concluded secondhand smoke is damaging.

However, it is true that the health risks of breathing in other people's tobacco smoke are much smaller than those posed by actually smoking.

And the pro-smoking lobby, including the campaigning group FOREST, argue that the case against passive smoking has never been properly proved.

They point to a study by the University of California published in the British Medical Journal which found that the link between environmental tobacco smoke and coronary heart disease and lung cancer may be considerably weaker than generally believed.

This in turn, is disputed by the anti-smoking lobby, which points out that after considering the BMJ study, the UK Government's Committee on Carcinogens and SCOTH still concluded that environmental tobacco smoke is carcinogenic, and responsible for several hundred deaths a year in the UK.

How widespread is passive smoking?

Of course, anybody who regularly frequents pubs or bars is inevitably going to breathe in a significant amount of tobacco smoke.

However, a survey by the anti-smoking charity ASH in 1999 found that about 3million people in the UK are exposed to passive smoke at work.

And it is also estimated that almost half of all children in the UK are exposed to tobacco smoke at home.

One study found that in households where both parents smoke, young children have a 72% increased risk of respiratory illnesses.

Research also shows that children whose parents smoke in the home are more likely to be admitted to hospital for bronchitis and pneumonia in the first year of life.

More than 17,000 children under the age of five are admitted to hospital every year because of the effects of passive smoking.

What do other countries do?

Banning smoking in public places is a highly controversial move, which has been resisted by the UK government so far.

However, some countries, including Ireland, Turkey and Norway, have accepted that a ban is the only way to tackle the problem of smoking effectively.

Despite concerns from the hospitality industry, the ban on smoking in public places in Ireland, which began in March this year, has not affected business, according to reports.

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#14794 - 21st Oct 2004 10:01am Re: Liverpool to vote on smoking ban
AX_125 Offline

Forum Guardian

Registered: 10th Nov 2003
Posts: 3791
Loc: Home
Quote:
Yeah that should be up there at the top of the list with Murder Hardly enforceable is it?
Smoking related illnesses direct or in direct costs the NHS millions each year.

Smoking creates rubbish, i read some where smoking and smoking related products count up for 44% of all rubbish thrown on the floor in city centres, again costing councils millions to remove it.

Smoking when pregnant causes all kinds of health problems for the new born Baby.

Smoking is a cause/trigger for Asthma

Smoking makes people uncomfortable.

Smoking makes people smell.

Personally I think banning smoking should be very high on everyones priority list as smoking related illnesses kill more people than murderers do!
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#14795 - 21st Oct 2004 10:38am Re: Liverpool to vote on smoking ban
StuyMac Offline

Wiki Master

Registered: 24th Nov 2003
Posts: 12002
Loc: Wirralshire
Quote:
Originally posted by AX_125:
Quote:
Yeah that should be up there at the top of the list with Murder Hardly enforceable is it?
Smoking related illnesses direct or in direct costs the NHS millions each year.

But the money raised in Taxes on Tabbacco is greater than the cost to treat smoking related illness eek
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#14796 - 21st Oct 2004 10:41am Re: Liverpool to vote on smoking ban
AX_125 Offline

Forum Guardian

Registered: 10th Nov 2003
Posts: 3791
Loc: Home
I wonder how much of that goes back into the NHS?

Alot of it seems to go on campaigns to stop people smoking.
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#14797 - 21st Oct 2004 2:30pm Re: Liverpool to vote on smoking ban
Tony MK2 Offline
Forum Master

Registered: 2nd Dec 2003
Posts: 2943
Loc: Wirral
Liverpool smoke ban bid welcomed


A special petition must be presented to the Commons

The decision to make Liverpool the UK's first smoke-free city has been welcomed by health campaigners.
The city council voted to ban smoking in restaurants, pubs, shops, offices and enclosed workplaces on Wednesday.

They will have to petition Parliament by 27 November so that a smoke-free law for Liverpool can be considered in the next legislative session.

The British Heart Foundation said Liverpool was "leading the country and showing the government the way."

Spokeswoman Dr Charmaine Griffiths said it was "fantastic News".

Other cities in the UK should now follow this lead

Ben Youdan, No Smoking Day
"We applaud the efforts of local campaigners in Liverpool to achieve this landmark decision, which received cross-party support and the support of the people.

"We now hope the Government not only supports this ban but extends it to a national level as soon as possible to protect non-smokers from the proven and unnecessary health risks of passive smoking," she said.

The charity No Smoking Day added that the ban should give smokers an incentive to quit.

Chief executive Ben Youdan said: "Other cities in the UK should now follow this lead which will have a dramatic impact on the health and wellbeing of the population."

'Protecting health'

The British Lung Foundation said it was "delighted" by the decision.

"By taking this step, Liverpool will be protecting the health of its workers, particularly in bars and restaurants. We hope that Liverpool will lead by example and see the ban roll out across the UK," chief executive Dame Helena Shovelton said.

Liverpool City Council says it will impose a fine of 1,000 on anyone breaching the law, which it wants passed within a year.

Councillor Richard Oglethorpe, the city council's executive member of green issues, said Liverpool is the "lung cancer capital of the United Kingdom."

"It's not a title we're proud of, it's one we want to get rid of," he said.

"Most smokers want to give up and the place where they find it hardest to give up is when you go into a bar.

"You've had a few drinks, everyone else is smoking so people tend to go back to their old ways.

"Introducing the smoking ban will help people give up."

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